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Cynical ploy or reality?
grizzly1911
Posts: 9,965 Forumite
Unemployment could be almost double the official figure of 2.5 million when groups such as the economically inactive are added to the total, union organisation the TUC has said.
The figures are far higher than official data once wider measures of joblessness are included, it said.
The TUC said that on top of the 2.5 million, 2.26 million people wanted a job but were not classified as jobless.
Employment Minister Mark Hoban said it showed the unions were "out of touch".
The number of people out of work fell by 46,000 to 2.56 million in the three months to June, according to the Office for National Statistics.
'Job crisis' The TUC report was published ahead of the TUC Congress in Bournemouth later.
Its general secretary Frances O'Grady said: "Unemployment may have started to fall in recent months but we are still in the midst of a job crisis.
"The true scale of unemployment is far bigger than official figures suggest, as nearly five million people say they want work today.
"With a further 1.4 million people only able to find part-time work, despite needing a full-time job to get by, it's clear that our labour market remains far from full healthy."
Mr O'Grady said it was important that official unemployment figures better reflected the "true nature" of the jobs market.
"We know that the recent fall in unemployment has been driven by short hours, low pay, temporary contracts, and jobs that offer no guarantee of paid work at all. These types of jobs cannot form the basis for a secure and sustainable economic recovery," he said.
"We also need ministers to face up to people's concerns about under-employment and insecure, low-paid work, which they have so far failed to acknowledge even exist.
"Unless we start getting more high-quality jobs and decent pay rises, this recovery is going to feel pretty joyless to most people."
Employment Minister Mr Hoban said: "Once again the unions are showing just how out of touch they are.
"Rather than welcoming the fact that employment is at a record high and the number of people claiming out of work benefits has fallen, they are determined to talk down both the economy and perhaps worse - the people who have actually worked hard to find themselves a job.
"This is nothing but a cynical ploy from Labour's trade unions. The economy is growing and jobs are being created and they can't bear to welcome that."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24005723
The figures are far higher than official data once wider measures of joblessness are included, it said.
The TUC said that on top of the 2.5 million, 2.26 million people wanted a job but were not classified as jobless.
Employment Minister Mark Hoban said it showed the unions were "out of touch".
The number of people out of work fell by 46,000 to 2.56 million in the three months to June, according to the Office for National Statistics.
'Job crisis' The TUC report was published ahead of the TUC Congress in Bournemouth later.
Its general secretary Frances O'Grady said: "Unemployment may have started to fall in recent months but we are still in the midst of a job crisis.
"The true scale of unemployment is far bigger than official figures suggest, as nearly five million people say they want work today.
"With a further 1.4 million people only able to find part-time work, despite needing a full-time job to get by, it's clear that our labour market remains far from full healthy."
Mr O'Grady said it was important that official unemployment figures better reflected the "true nature" of the jobs market.
"We know that the recent fall in unemployment has been driven by short hours, low pay, temporary contracts, and jobs that offer no guarantee of paid work at all. These types of jobs cannot form the basis for a secure and sustainable economic recovery," he said.
"We also need ministers to face up to people's concerns about under-employment and insecure, low-paid work, which they have so far failed to acknowledge even exist.
"Unless we start getting more high-quality jobs and decent pay rises, this recovery is going to feel pretty joyless to most people."
Employment Minister Mr Hoban said: "Once again the unions are showing just how out of touch they are.
"Rather than welcoming the fact that employment is at a record high and the number of people claiming out of work benefits has fallen, they are determined to talk down both the economy and perhaps worse - the people who have actually worked hard to find themselves a job.
"This is nothing but a cynical ploy from Labour's trade unions. The economy is growing and jobs are being created and they can't bear to welcome that."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24005723
"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham
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Comments
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So what are they saying, that all those with 'bad backs' should be looking for work?“I could see that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far from being gruntled.” - P.G. Wodehouse0
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I don't think it's a cynical ploy. It's pretty much common knowledge.
I believe we need more than one set of unemployment figures however. One which shows different types of work. The unemployment figures continue to measure the same thing even though the working world around them has changed drastically, with more self employed, more zero hours etc.0 -
the government publishes a vast amount of data on employment, unemployed, NEETs, disabled, etc etc
the media and interested parties pick and choose which figure to talk about.
all open and above board.0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »I believe we need more than one set of unemployment figures however. One which shows different types of work. The unemployment figures continue to measure the same thing even though the working world around them has changed drastically, with more self employed, more zero hours etc.
I've taken short term temporary work over the years, to fill in between longer term assignments. So what's new? In these difficult times having an income from work is far better than being on the dole.0 -
Thrugelmir wrote: »I've taken short term temporary work over the years, to fill in between longer term assignments. So what's new? In these difficult times having an income from work is far better than being on the dole.
Well of course it is.
But that wasn't my point.
My point was about the figures measuring the same thing when the workplace is changing. I can't remember the figures off the top of my head, but how many are now self employed?
Just a thought really on how the figures measure the same thing in a changing world.0 -
Graham_Devon wrote: »I don't think it's a cynical ploy. It's pretty much common knowledge.
I believe we need more than one set of unemployment figures however. One which shows different types of work. The unemployment figures continue to measure the same thing even though the working world around them has changed drastically, with more self employed, more zero hours etc.
We already have more than one set of unemployment figures.
It's worth noting that the union rep believes an extra 2.26 million could be added but neglects to comment on whether this 2.26m is increasing or decreasing. The absolute numbers mean little in isolation.
A classic case of trying to compare apples to pears to make a (non) point.0 -
We already have more than one set of unemployment figures.
It's worth noting that the union rep believes an extra 2.26 million could be added but neglects to comment on whether this 2.26m is increasing or decreasing. The absolute numbers mean little in isolation.....
Was going to say similar myself.
The figures are all there somewhere to see trends etc. There has to be some definition and the important thing (to me) is not its definition itself, but keeping it constant so trends can be seen.
If there are an additional 2.26 million 'looking for work', which I doubt very highly, then hopefully they are pushing and shoving with all the rest to secure one of the increasing number becoming available. So I don't know what TUC wants anyone to do to these people? Give them more money? Give them free TUC membership so they can go on strike? I don't know...
How did the TUC ask these people about how actively they are looking? Presumably I am included in his figures. Of working age, not claiming anything, not even dreaming of looking for work.0 -
If they are looking for work and are available to start work then they do count as unemployed. So I don't really get what the TUC is on about.“I could see that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far from being gruntled.” - P.G. Wodehouse0
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If they are looking for work and are available to start work then they do count as unemployed. So I don't really get what the TUC is on about.
Not if they don't register as unemployed."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
grizzly1911 wrote: »Not if they don't register as unemployed.
You don't have to register as unemployed, they work it out from a survey.“I could see that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far from being gruntled.” - P.G. Wodehouse0
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