Real environmental impact of electric car?

Ultrasonic

This BBC story includes information on a significant study into the environmental impact of electric cars. A major factor is how the electricity is produced, so if you can power yours with solar panels then this helps.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22001356

Guinness-Cat

londonTiger wrote: »

electric cars will pick up, but for the time being it's the preserve of 6 figure earning city executives who can afford to pay over the odds for an electric.

Not true - the main reason for me to buy electric was cost. My round trip to work and back is just over 55 miles - So I went for a 1 year old ex demo leaf at a cost of £150 per month on a PCP deal (15,000 Miles per year). This is around the cost difference between the diesel I was using and the electric I'm now using.

This was with a 2K deposit, which I was OK for since it meant I would be driving a new car (previous was 15 years old) and have no costs for repairs \ MOT's \ servicing \ Road Tax.

There are lots of Nissan Leaf's on sale with low milages because they are dealer ex-demo cars and number of dealers don't appear to be keen on doing deals on them. For example, My local nissan dealer has 5 for sale, all low milage ex-demo ones, but I bought mine from a dealer 100 miles away since he was considerably cheaper on cost, and sold a far higher number of them. I think there is a lot of negativity in certain dealers.

There won't be too many on the market with higher milages because most were bought on a 3 year pcp deal (due to the unknown about the battery) so expect a lot on the market towards the middle of next year.

Looking on UK Leaf forums, no-one has reported any substantial battery loss in the UK - it's mainly an issue in a lot warmer countries - and as far as can be seen the batteries will last a lot longer than rumoured on top gear.

worried_jim

French cars have an abysmal reputation for electrical’s so buying one full of electricity will be a big gamble. I would wait for the BMW versions which are due to arrive any day now or go more mainstream with a plug in Toyota.
If you do get one please come back and share your experience.

tbourner

Interesting stuff. Ultra did you look at vaio's link? One point is that even solar panels and the like cause vast amounts of environmental issues which are largely ignored by those promoting their use.
Otherwise I agree, and linking with london's point that we're not quite there yet; in the future we may have towns producing their own energy for local distribution as well as houses generating some, reducing losses over distance that we have now, coupled with fusion plants and we would have enough electricity to not worry too much about it. Electric cars would then be an obvious choice. Again, if it weren't for the hidden 'costs' of producing the PV cells, CHP heating systems etc. etc.

On a similar point, vaio's link mentioned comparing electric with walking/cycling etc. (as opposed to ICE vehicles), but even then you have to factor in the energy used by the person. I can't remember the exact figures but a person who cycles and eats a hypothetical diet of mostly red meat, would pollute the environment a lot more than a person who drives a large uneconomical 4x4!! This then comes back to the fact that those types of facts are based on current tech, if the production/transport/packaging etc. of red meat products followed eco-friendly futuristic principles then that problem also goes away!

Basically, you can push the problem around but it will show up somewhere in the system.

forgotmyname

So your going to spend £10,000 + a minimum of £70 a month on the battery hire for the car to sit there on charge?

1 charging point near your work. What if its in use already?

Sounds like you want one to show your eco friendly. But your not.

tbourner

forgotmyname wrote: »

So your going to spend £10,000 + a minimum of £70 a month on the battery hire for the car to sit there on charge?

1 charging point near your work. What if its in use already?

Sounds like you want one to show your eco friendly. But your not.

Well like I said I bought a diesel estate even though we only do <10k miles per year and most of those are around town. I like the way a diesel delivers power so I prefer it to a petrol.
So I'd happily spend £15,000 + a monthly cost if I like the car. I like the way electric cars have a single gear and flat torque curve (like an ultimate diesel!), I like the fact you can turn the climate control on at 7 every morning so when you get in summer or winter it's perfect temperature inside. In terms of the Zoe I like the looks of it, the dash layout etc. etc. I LIKE the car so I'll happily buy one regardless of the costs or amount of use.

On the other point, you may be right, I do WANT to BE eco friendly not just look eco friendly though, which is why I started this thread, to get more info on the facts.
I'll probably still buy one, but I'll tell people I like the car rather than I'm saving the world

Guinness-Cat

It's 3 years old now, but still lots relevant - one of Robert Llewellyn's best:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfTiRNzbSko

londonTiger

Guinness-Cat wrote: »

Not true - the main reason for me to buy electric was cost. My round trip to work and back is just over 55 miles - So I went for a 1 year old ex demo leaf at a cost of £150 per month on a PCP deal (15,000 Miles per year). This is around the cost difference between the diesel I was using and the electric I'm now using.

This was with a 2K deposit, which I was OK for since it meant I would be driving a new car (previous was 15 years old) and have no costs for repairs \ MOT's \ servicing \ Road Tax.

You can probably make it work, but for most people an electric car is strictly a second car, very limited to the odd city runs. As mentioned by others when driving in aqdverse conditions, long trips or carrying a lot of load you're not going to get far on electric and need a backup petrol car.

Maybe you can get back on an electric as your sole car. But most people who have a family (kids) will need something bigger to do their weekly shopping and drive out to. A very high amount of people actually drive in for work in London. A 60 mile cap will mean you're scraping the capacity of your batteries on your daily commute.

dannny_2

Hydrogen fuel cell cars are the future, not electric cars.

Main 3 UK production methods of electricity are coal, gas and nuclear.

Very environmentally friendly, NOT.

londonTiger

forgotmyname wrote: »

So your going to spend £10,000 + a minimum of £70 a month on the battery hire for the car to sit there on charge?

1 charging point near your work. What if its in use already?

Sounds like you want one to show your eco friendly. But your not.

there are supermarkets with free charging, and you can always charge from home to cover a round trip. However I think when the electric cars become more popular you can count on land owners and councils charging a premium for parking in a charge point.

The other concern is electric cars make driving boring. In a petrol/diesel car you can floor it, your mpg does not change that much. If I drive aggressive i get around 29mpg, if i drive conservatively i get 32mpg.

Now drive aggressive on an electric car and i don't know how far you'd get. Didn't TG do laps on the tesla and manage just 4 or 5 laps on it before the battery died?

I think electric cars will take out the joy of driving entirely, and it's take up will coincide with the development of self driving cars because nobody wants to drive any more. My guess is we'll just all use pool cars to get around you subscribe to a scheme which will allow you to hail a self driving electric car to drive you around.