who Has the Right

Mojisola

kevin51 wrote: »

Again I forgot to mention There is no will involved and everything has been handled by the family in a very respectable fashion. No family members are arguing over money. My brother was chosen to be executor by all the family, because he is the eldest. We just need to verify that what he doing is fair to everyone, that's all.

If there is no will then whoever is administering the estate has to follow the intestacy rules. It's not open season for the family to distribute the estate as they want.

thorsoak

kevin51 wrote: »

Hi,

Again I forgot to mention There is no will involved and everything has been handled by the family in a very respectable fashion. No family members are arguing over money. My brother was chosen to be executor by all the family, because he is the eldest. We just need to verify that what he doing is fair to everyone, that's all.

thx for all the replies

If there is no will, there is no executor. The laws of intestacy in England & Wales are stated quite clearly who is entitled to inherit :- http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/cto/customerguide/page14-11.htm.

I said in my previous post "So the total value of the estate is 30% of the value of the property. If your brother buys 100% of the property, then 70% of the cost that your brother pays will go to the Housing Association. The remaining 30% goes to your sister's estate. The first call upon your sister's estate is payment of her debts."

That remains the case. Anything remaining from the 30% value of the house after all debts (including funeral costs) goes to your father.

FatVonD

I think what is clouding the issue for the OP is that the brother wants to pay the debts with his own money and then take the 30% share as repayment for that and then only buy the 70%. I think that may be where the OP and his siblings feel the elder brother may be unfairly getting something that they aren't (even though none of them are entitled to anything anyway as it was left to the father.) Call it sibling rivalry but they probably think it's 'not fair'.

The eldest brother needs to be told to do things in the correct order, buy the house at a fair market rate and then pay the debts from the 30%. If he does it this way then, to some extent, the sale price will be controlled by the 70% stakeholder as they won't be prepared to sell below market rate. If the brother does it the way he proposes he could be paying less per percent for that 30% than for the rest of it and effectively diddling his own father.

Do the debts that need to be paid off amount to about the same as 30% of the value of the property, OP?

Savvy_Sue

Kayalana99 wrote: »

If their is no will, then it goes to next of kin.

Not sure who is next of kin to be honest but it will be one person.

No it won't! There's an easy to follow guide to the Laws of Intestacy here.

Sorry, didn't spot page 2 of this thread before posting.

kevin51

Hi,
Does that mean that the father being the oldest automatically
becomes the beneficiary, as there are 4 other siblings involved here. As I am unsure in this instant who has authority.
Surely if my decided to buy the property he would have to inform others and buy their share from them out of the 30% it does not
give him rights just because he is the executor, as he doesn't own my sisters property. Remembering there was no will left from my sister. I'm just trying to clean up on a few things here.
any help would be appreciated.

Thx

Kevin

Mojisola

If your sister did not have a spouse or a civil partner or children, then anything she left would be divided between her parents. If her mother has already died, then her father inherits everything she leaves.

Dunroamin

kevin51 wrote: »

Hi,

Again I forgot to mention There is no will involved and everything has been handled by the family in a very respectable fashion. No family members are arguing over money. My brother was chosen to be executor by all the family, because he is the eldest. We just need to verify that what he doing is fair to everyone, that's all.

thx for all the replies

If that's the case, why did you say in your first post that the property had been left to your father?

Savvy_Sue

kevin, if you work through this easy to follow guide to the Laws of Intestacy (a link from HMRC which thorsoak and I have each already given you once), it should help you work out who the beneficiaries are.

To help you, I've worked through the guide using certain assumptions, and it says:

You have selected the following

• The estate is in England & Wales
• There is no surviving spouse or civil partner
• There are no surviving children or issue of children
• There are surviving parents

If this is not correct return to page 14 of the Customer Guide
If this is correct, the deceased’s surviving parents will receive the whole estate in equal shares.

My emphasis.



Now, my assumptions may be wrong: your sister may have an estranged partner to whom she was still married at the time of death, she may have 16 children and 96 grandchildren, and so on, but I don't believe you've mentioned anything like that.



But if my assumptions are correct, your sister's entire estate passes to your father. If he doesn't want the house, and your brother does, then your brother can buy the house, but what doesn't go to the HA goes to your father. You and your surviving siblings are not entitled to anything.



Your brother has a duty to do what is best for the beneficiaries. Buying the house himself may or may not be best, but it doesn't sound completely wrong-headed as long as he pays a fair price - and as has already been pointed out, the HA won't accept a stupid price.



What your father chooses to do with the money then is up to him, it becomes his money.

Kynthia

If there is no will then laws of intestacy must be followed by the executer. There is a set order of who inherits everything. If there is no husband and there are no children then the parents get the whole estate. Siblings get nothing if there is a parent alive and no will leaving anything to the siblings. You and your siblings do not have a share of the property as you are not beneficiaries.

Therefore the executor must handle the estate and ensure your father, the sole beneficiary, gets the best deal from it all. He must pay all debts from the estate including the funeral from whatever money and assets there are and either give the property to your dad or sell it to someone and give the proceeds for your sister's share to your dad after all debts are paid (even if he sells it to himself). Your brother and you are not entitled to anything, nor any discount on the property.

GwylimT

Your father is the sole beneficiary, therefore if your brother or anyone buys the house the money will firstly be used to pay any costs, e.g. solicitors, any debts your sister may have, the remaining money will then go to your father.