Water soaking brickwork from neighbour's leaking toilet

robgoingcrazy

JohnB47 wrote: »

Ok, sorry. When you said in an earlier post 'have turned off the water again and drained taps ...' I didn't realise that you meant turned off at the stopcock. My mistake.

Well, I'm not sure what to suggest now. To be honest, I feel its either his roof leaking or his pipework leaking. I can't see how any of your pipework should be inboard of his extension wall in the first place.

You indicated earlier that your neighbour ripped a few things out and said he found a leak. What was the outcome from that again?

He said he had fixed it.

The water wasn't really drying up, so I stuck a hair drier out there for half an hour, and the slab in the corner was bone dry, left it half an hour to see what happened, and more water has appeared on the slab.

However, I can't hear the dripping sound at all as far as I can tell, on the last 3 times I have listened for it.

Say the water IS somehow from one of my pipes, could any water appearing now be residual water that was inside the bricks/cavity/pipe prior to turning off my water? Am keeping the water off for the time being and seeing what happens.

robgoingcrazy

Sigh. Was going to have one last look and listen, it seemed as if the water appearing on the slab might be slowly slowing down (but I really can't be sure of that), so I was going to listen very carefully, then turn on my water main again, and see if the dripping sound returned and the appearance of the water perceptibly increased.

But when I went it was throwing it down yet again, so I guess I might have to just try turning it on and off for shorter periods and see if I can detect a pattern in the dripping sound matched to whether the water's on or off?

Winter_Phoenix

Just a thought, but you should be able to tell whether the water is coming from YOUR basin, bath, lavatory etc. by pouring some food-dye down each one over a period of days. Different coloured food-dye down each outlet should identify which one (if any) is causing the problem - check by pressing a piece of white cloth or kitchen roll against the brickwork where the water is coming through (after giving it time to seep through).

Watered-down emulsion paint could also be used, but the colours wouldn't be as clear.

You can buy food-dye in the baking section of big supermarkets.

robgoingcrazy

Winter_Phoenix wrote: »

Just a thought, but you should be able to tell whether the water is coming from YOUR basin, bath, lavatory etc. by pouring some food-dye down each one over a period of days. Different coloured food-dye down each outlet should identify which one (if any) is causing the problem - check by pressing a piece of white cloth or kitchen roll against the brickwork where the water is coming through (after giving it time to seep through).

Watered-down emulsion paint could also be used, but the colours wouldn't be as clear.

You can buy food-dye in the baking section of big supermarkets.

Thanks that's an interesting idea, I might try it. However I'm wondering if it's some kind of supply pipe, as the water has to get up to the bathroom somehow, I know the mains is at the front, but there must be pipes going everywhere to feed the toilet, bath, shower, and bathroom sink, I'm wondering if that goes to the back of the house to where the kitchen sink and boiler is, and then up to the bathroom somehow - certainly the water supply has to get up there by some means or other, before it gets down...

From what I observed it seemed to be clearly coming from above rather than below, as a previous poster suggested. Once I'd dried the spot I could see where it was forming, which was about 6 inches away from the corner/side of the neighbour's extension, it then spreads back towards the corner, I don't know if that helps anyone made some more educated guesses.

I will certainly check for the dripping sound first, I am convinced it stopped while my water was off, but the rain made it impossible to continue my observations. I will repeat the experiment to see if I can make the cessation of the dripping noise repeatable when the water mains is off, in the spirit of science!

robgoingcrazy

Well I don't know what's next, I went outside to listen for the dripping sound and can't hear it today with my water on, so no point switching water off to see if it stops. Guess all I can hope for is a dry day so I can empty the entire system and make a long observation.

Needless to say it's been raining again so everywhere is soaked anyway!

Would I be within my rights to get British Gas out again and point out that the soil pipe/water overflow over the extension is actually mine, and therefore I do have plumbing above the source of the water which is (even if remotely) possibly coming from my side?

ETA: or get another opinion from another builder/plumber?

Doozergirl

Did your builder recommend doing anything?

You have a lot of drainage in that back area running into old clay pipe drains and you also have a not particularly well constructed extension right next to your drain.

If water is coming from high up, there will be some evidence on the inside walls of either you or your neighbours house and the pattern might appear more random and patchy. I think that a CCTV drain survey might be helpful as it's possible that the drains are damaged. It certainly wouldn't be unusual in a house of your type and age. In a mid terrace, the water company would almost certainly be responsible for the repairs

Or post #55 is also something that I'd be doing first if worried about the expense of the drain survey.

robgoingcrazy

Doozergirl wrote: »

Did your builder recommend doing anything?

You have a lot of drainage in that back area running into old clay pipe drains and you also have a not particularly well constructed extension right next to your drain.

If water is coming from high up, there will be some evidence on the inside walls of either you or your neighbours house and the pattern might appear more random and patchy. I think that a CCTV drain survey might be helpful as it's possible that the drains are damaged. It certainly wouldn't be unusual in a house of your type and age. In a mid terrace, the water company would almost certainly be responsible for the repairs

Or post #55 is also something that I'd be doing first if worried about the expense of the drain survey.

My builder suggested speaking to the neighbour, which resulted in neighbour ripping out his bathroom, which he did, and he can't see any damp patches on walls and neither can I!

I have plumbing and drains cover with British Gas, but the bloke who came out took a look and said "nowt to do with your plumbing or drains that mate".

When I dried the area and looked I could definitely see water beading where the brick is cracked away and trickling from above but it might be working its way from further along, nobody who looks at it seems to have a clue.

I might have to try someone else and ask them what they make of the pipework layout in bathroom etc, I don't have a clue. I taught myself html, php and javascript just by looking at the code and figuring it out, but for practical stuff like this I need help :cool:

robgoingcrazy

Ok, today I was working away from home for a number of hours so I turned off the water mains and drained the taps and toilet, it had rained overnight so everywhere was wet anyway, but it looked like it might stay dry.

Got back and all the slabs were dry apart from the corner, which was covered in water. Dried it out with a heater and hair drier, and could make out the same steady trickle of water coming down from above somewhere. Very small trickle, but it started to grow and spread outwards as it trickled. Can't make out where it's coming from, can just see it appearing on the brick surface before landing the slab and spreading.

So from that it looks impossible to be from my house?

I'm at a loss, cracking my head open when I went to pick up my torch after dropping it in the dark, then banging my head on the bricks hasn't helped my sanity much. I really wish this experiment had succeeded in slowing down the water but it looks like I will have to pee off my neighbour again... But then he is at a loss as well.

Surely there is someone, somewhere who can look at this problem and figure out what's going on? Surely the water cannot be coming from a wormhole in some other dimension? It feels like that's the only explanation I can come up with!

The dripping sound BTW was a red herring, I can see (hear) now, it's clearly coming from residual water in the kitchen sink drainpipe dripping into the drain, it only happens if I empty the sink, then subsides as all the water gets out.

Another clue thrown out!

robgoingcrazy

My builder hasn't got back to me, I currently haven't got enough money to pay him to fix the wall that's missing coping stones (well I have, but at the moment making the wall look nice isn't a priority with debts and other outgoings I need to keep up!).

What's the process in getting someone out to look at the issue for an umpteenth opinion? I've been put off getting tradesmen out of yellow pages or the the local paper, as many years ago when my boiler went wrong, some bloke came and fiddled around with it, said he couldn't fix it, and that will be £65 mate (or about £100 in today's money), another bloke came and fiddled around all day and didn't charge me, but couldn't fix it either, that's when I went with British Gas to put in a new one.

I don't want to pay someone to come out and say they haven't got a clue, I could do with someone who can look at all the pipework and figure out what pipes are going where.

I will speak to my neighbour again when I see him, it's a pity he took matters into his own hands as if he'd let me go in with my builder chap perhaps we could have isolated the problem.

I can't see that the water in the corner is ever actually changing in intensity - it was still forming the wet patch hours after the neighbour had gone to bed last night, what seems to happen is that trickle trickles for hours and then rolls into the corner over many hours, then when whatever's underneath there is totally saturated it floods back out over the slab, it's not like the water patterns (one day in the corner, the next surging outwards) have anything to do with rain, or his use, or my use, the water just seems this constant trickle coming from somewhere above...

I will scour the local paper and if I get someone out confirm on the phone that there's no charge for a look, I wouldn't mind paying something if they could actually provide just an answer :mad:

robgoingcrazy

Do I need a plumber or a builder?

The British Gas man said you need a builder to look at that mate...

My builder said it looked like a plumbing problem (though probably next door's)

I will call around but am working all today, client facing