advice needed asap.

zaksmum

I would never leave ANY dog alone with a child no matter how soft and gentle that dog may be.

joansgirl

Why has nobody stated the obvious.
At the risk of annoying all you dog owners, i would be terrified of leaving
such an unpredictable dog with a child. It may be fine most of the time but ALL
dog owners seem to think their dogs are safe and "wouldn't hurt a fly ", how
many have been proved wrong. Don't leave your children alone with
him.

Well said Krlyr. I don't think that any dog should be trusted absolutely, 100%. The most docile of humans is capable of lashing out given the right (or wrong!) provocation, but whereas we can shout and scream and stamp our feet or push someone away a dog has only got it's mouth. Any responsible owner (as op obviously is) will be aware of the hazards of dog + kids. And not all dog owners think their dogs "wouldn't hurt a fly". Most of us live in the real world

catkins

I also agree that no dog can EVER be trusted 100%. My previous dog, although being dog reactive, loved people and was so gentle. As I said, he used to just lie there while my young nieces brushed him and put his fur in plaits, pigtails etc. I always supervised while they were with him though.

neveranymoney

Right, this may be very long winded and possibly make no sense as I have a lot to process. Plus I am on my phone.

The behaviour man came and stayed for well over 3 hours, nearly double what I booked and paid him for. He had a little Tupperware dish full of delicious things and of course scampers was model citizen. After a detailed questionare about the actual bite, scamps behaviour to humans and in all aspects the general feelings are this;

Behaviourist said he is healthy looking, with possibly a tiny bit of bull terrier somewhere in him about the chops, he was a clever wee fella and good and calm and chilled in his own house and with a visitor.

After our phone call, he had felt concern about the severity of the bite and had spoken to other colleagues about it. He rated it as a 3a on a bite scale of 1-5 and said that had it been any higher, especially with us having children he would have refused to work with us but his gut reaction was that he was scared of other dogs and his aggression was towards them only. Another pointer towards this as in previous meeting with other dogs where we have trailed him away from other well meaning but clueless people saying their dog is alright, blah, blah and scampers is leaping like a lamb, a bite had not been misdirected at us as we removed him.

After hearing how the bite occurred, he feels that scampers was very startled, as the other dog literally came round a corner and was up to him in seconds. This, he feels could be a double edged sword as it says it was all too much to quick for scamp as with my husband having him on a tight leash, it was his only choice, BUT, what if he is startled by something else?

The man was truly fantastic, he said he was fully prepared coming to our house not to take to scamp and would have offered to take him to the rescue in his van to save me the pain had I wanted that but he definitely feels like he can work with us.

He said he felt sorry for us as it was almost like grieving after scampers did it, as this was not what we had signed up for when we took him home (can't remember if I said previously, were told he lived with a westie, owners had a fire and they couldn't keep them in their new accommodation) and we would have to have a long discussion wether we kept him or not.

He gave me reams of infor about ladders of aggression, cartoons of doggie language and games and simple training to do and emphasised the whole family must be involved in this.

He also said he knows people who never feed a dog with a bowl and all their dinner is hand fed to build up trust and bond, so this is something to think about.

We went out into our street with a long lead and wandered about, he said scampers was alert but in no way stressed. Of course there wasn't a dog in sight so we plodded home and a small dog behind a fence went APE growling and barking, scampers went mental too and I thought, 'here we go' but the guy had delicious treats and called his name and he turned to see and took the treat and didn't maul his hand off.

We are to walk him in non mad dog places, ie, where we can make a good get away and have yum treats and make a fuss as we walk nicely past, muzzled of course.

He did comment on the fact that he took to the muzzle so quickly after just 2 days and wondered had he been muzzled previously? Of course he tried to get it off when out but he sticks his nose in it straight away.

He is emailing me a plan of action and will be back out in a fortnight to see how we are getting on (free of charge) and I can phone him at any time. If things have gone well, he will teach us proper training then.

krlyr

Sounds absolutely fantastic, I hope all your hard work pays off and you can learn to enjoy walking Scampers a bit more in the near future

Person_one

This guy sounds fab, I'm so glad things are going well and that progress is starting to be made.

merlin1

I have just read your thread op and well... your trainer sounds spot on! I would have no problems asking you for his name should I ever need help again :beer:
All the very best of luck and hugs to you and yours

Wellyboots6

neveranymoney wrote: »

he was scared of other dogs and his aggression was towards them only. Another pointer towards this as in previous meeting with other dogs where we have trailed him away from other well meaning but clueless people saying their dog is alright, blah, blah and scampers is leaping like a lamb, a bite had not been misdirected at us as we removed him.

BUT, what if he is startled by something else?

This is positive if it does seem it is only aggression aimed at other dogs as you can focus your work.

Scampers differs to my boy in that respect, as he will misdirect bites when he is 'in the zone' of going after another dog. He seems to be ok if you can distract him enough to get him to turn away from the other dog, but you would definitely not be wise to get between him and a dog he is after. Hence the muzzle! This is where I am seeing the most progress with my dog, I am actually being more and more able to distract him whereas he used to be totally fixated on the other dog until you dragged him away.

With regards the being startled, I have found the 'behind me' command to be one of the most useful to use for that situation. He used to bite whatever was closest when startled by anything, such as phone, knock at door etc. I started doing a lot of getting him to jump behind me, just for fun. We then extended it to if I saw something I knew he was nervous of, such as wheelbarrows. Got him to jump behind me as we passed it. That is now starting to become his default reaction if he gets frightened by something, which means as he is moving to get behind me he is not biting!

You will start to find little tricks to use that specifically fit with Scampers particular issues and his personality, and when they start to work you will realize you are making progress

I think my boys issues stem from having being kept isolated but able to see other dogs and so he learnt to lunge and bark at the other dogs but never had to deal with the consequences as he was never able to interact with them.

He was also never taught any boundaries and learnt to get what he wanted by using his teeth or threatening to bite. This is still his default reaction when stressed or over-excited, but knowing what his triggers are is helping greatly in reducing the munchy incidents!

Good luck OP and enjoy the training. It will help you bond a lot with Scampers, and him with you. The more he trusts you to know what behaviour is right in a particular situation, the more likely it is he will start to turn to you to deal with other dogs for him

krlyr

Oh, a little tip - something like Primula squeezy cheese can be a fab muzzle-friendly reward. You can pop the nozzle through the bars and squeeze out a little cheese for him to lick off as his reward, without faffing around trying to post treats through the muzzle.

neveranymoney

I am feeling mixed emotions if I am being blunt. The reward training really was a thing to behold, I was walking up and down the kitchen after the guy had gone with food in my hand, getting scamp to walk nicely beside me and he really loved it all. However, his bite is still of concern to me, I don't care that I will have to muzzle him outdoors, (this doesn't put morons off, would you credit it? A cretin let his labs all over him but my husband shielded him and walked him on, moron man oblivious)

There is obviously loads more the guy told and showed us and he said, I know you won't believe me now, but eventually you will be looking for other dogs AT A DISTANCE to walk by and all sorts but my son is obviously my priority and he told me to really get him involved in feeding and training him. He has never shown any aggression to any human so I would like to ask, how many people here with dog reactive dogs have children under 10? My daughter is 14 so is a different kettle of fish entirely. Teenage girls are programmed not to jump around, be loud or generally move without motive, I have found.