To Frack, or Not To Frack...?

RuthnJasper

I was thinking, as I was listening to a news item about fracking on the radio this morning, about whether or not the fracking process was actually worth the potential environmental implications... And would it really have that much of an impact on fuel prices for the average householder?

I'm no soap-dodging protester, nor an enthusiast for new fuel sources using any new process - but I DO struggle to afford heating and I feel that, on the whole, I would personally prefer to pay a slightly higher fuel price rather than have fracking pounding away in various places.

I was just wondering what other people thought about it...?

Richie-from-the-Boro

RuthnJasper wrote: »

I was thinking, as I was listening to a news item about fracking on the radio this morning, about whether or not the fracking process was actually worth the potential environmental implications... And would it really have that much of an impact on fuel prices for the average householder?

I'm no soap-dodging protester, nor an enthusiast for new fuel sources using any new process - but I DO struggle to afford heating and I feel that, on the whole, I would personally prefer to pay a slightly higher fuel price rather than have fracking pounding away in various places.

I was just wondering what other people thought about it...?

You and everyone on these Islands will pay a higher price with or without and in spite of fracking. The price point wherever it is at any point in time will never be reduced by fracking and may well as is the case with stupid windy-mills even more savagely increase your electricity price even further. You and everyone else [average] is already paying £112 in green taxes – £18 of which is directly spent on subsidising wind farms, this is going to jump [150%] from £112 to £286 by 2020 according to DECC.

So regardless, a hard nosed realist or a 'tree-hugger', we are all going to pay more. Fracking may well add to the cost - one thing for sure it will never reduce the cost to the householder, any benefits in fuel security are welcome, but the idea that any financial benefit will go anywhere but the treasury is a fracking joke.

penrhyn

It would be interesting to know how many windmills it would take to produce the equivalent energy that one gas well would produce.
One answer would be infinity as windmills don't produce gas which is used to heat 70 to 80% of homes in the UK, and a substantial amount of electricity as well.

Looks like the Ecoloons will be out in force this week end. Pity their benefits can't be stopped.

Frack on Tommy.

marmitepotato

We don't want fracking, we don't want nuclear, we don't like wind turbines, we don't want coal any more, we don't like buying our energy from abroad, etc etc etc.... Something or someone has to 'give' otherwise its gonna get pretty dark and pretty cold very soon.

DragonQ

I know that most of the complaints about nuclear power aren't based in fact, due to actually learning about it in my degree. Wouldn't surprise me if the same was true of fracking but I don't know enough about it to decide, and don't care enough to research it.

Richie-from-the-Boro

marmitepotato wrote: »

We don't want fracking, we don't want nuclear, we don't like wind turbines, we don't want coal any more, we don't like buying our energy from abroad, etc etc etc.... Something or someone has to 'give' otherwise its gonna get pretty dark and pretty cold very soon.

- I've been [a realist] for nuclear forever, read my back threads
- its because we didn't build nuclear when we could afford to build, that we are in this situation now
- Osborne is still blowing kisses at EDF over the 30+ year guaranteed 'strike price' and getting nowhere
- EDF mainly owned by the French state operates France's 58 nuclear plants, our leccy money goes to the French anyway


Shale is so big in that very big country called the US of A that EDF was forced to completely pull out of nuclear production in that country. This is good because only one year ago EDF would not build any nuclear plants for our desperate begging bowl UK government. Maybe, just maybe now they will, but as I've often said why would the French build in the UK, even with Chinese money - they don't need to - they already get most of the profits from supplying the UK with their surplus nuclear generated spare electricity. Either way the 10% of useful and get-at-able shale gas will be extracted in the UK and there is nothing you or I or the stupid protests can do about it. Interesting isn't it that the safest places in the UK will become those with a nuclear facility - those areas won't be exploited / fracked.

sheffield_lad

I am 100% in favour of fracking, and have said so on other threads. What Greenpeace and NIMBYs forget to mention is that gas is not only used for electricity generation it is also the fuel 85% use to HEAT our homes. No amount of solar, wind, tidal etc will ever effect this. As we know the price of gas has risen over the last decade and I agree that fracking won't bring the cost down but it does make it less likely to rise as fast as without fracking. A good example of this is OPEC who reduce production to elevate the price of oil.

Now there is currently around 150yrs worth of natural gas in the world at current usage so there is not a need to frack but it does give security of our own fuel, rremember back in 2008? In that year the price of gas rose around 40% and has never come down (the same with petrol £1 now £1.40), this was a crisis caused by a dispute over a Russian gas pipeline such rises effect the world market price of gas but by having a secure reserve of gas our prices would not have risen as steep as they did.

Finally lets look at the hysterical reaction to fracking. There will not be a huge gas plant billowing smoke at the end of the road lol, it looks when complete like a medium sized garage sat in the middle of a field. The drill holes currently resemble the size of a dinner plate we are not looking at a scar on the landscape. How much can we frack in gas? Very hard to quantify but 30yrs worth at current use is a conservative estimate. Then think about the money treasury can expect. This is our money going towards public service the NHS etc many in the left corner have said the only reason the Torys were able to keep taxes low in the 1980's is/was due to North sea gas now we have another opportunity to gain money (maybe pay off some of the £1 trillion debt) finally think about the jobs which can be created? Around 10-30,000 in a new industry.

Last bit (honest), if we don't frack where do you think the gas you heat your home will come from? Someone has to produce it so any pollution is still going to happen although gas is a much cleaner fuel than the coal and other fossil fuels.

[Deleted User]

The Yorkshire towns, where I live, are criss crossed througout by mineworks, subsidence is not at all uncommon in all our towns, yet we all live with it . I heard one of these professional protesters saying that fracking causes earthquakes. Having awoken to a good one going off a few years back, centred on Market Rason, with my wardrobe shaking accross the room, I consider it a privelidge to witness this minor tremour. No damage at all was done in the area except one chimney pot falling off and other very minor things.By UK standards it was a big one. Earthquakes ! big deal

victor2

All useful large scale power generation systems rely on generating heat to create steam to drive turbines to drive generators. A lot of that heat comes from burning gas.
We've developed a society which relies on it so until an alternative way of generating electricity is found, we'll just have to keep on using the finite resources there are. We've coped with the messes we made extracting oil, so will doubtless do the same with the latest method for extracting gas.

But surely there has to be a non mechanical way of realistically generating large amounts of electricity....

penrhyn

The BBC is only too happy to give airtime to the Ecoloons.

Richie-from-the-Boro

I waited a day to see how the poll went and unsurprisingly :

- 76.92% voted for fracking & cheaper fuel
- 23.08% for no fracking and higher prices

I did not respond to the survey because it assumes that more carbon in the form of fracking will make bills lower than they would otherwise be, I however do not think our bills will be lower by even one penny with fracking ............... I hope I'm proved wrong ................. as for carbon the cheapest and most energy secure countries in Europe are those with nuclear and the most expensive are those with taxpayer subsidised green windy-mills.

Now where did I leave my leather sandals and hair shirt !