Acknowledge LBC or give correct driver details?

Stroma

That is of course up to you, but my instinct on this is that it is simply a templated letter sent out by roxburghe in disguise, they do not do court! And this PCN NW certainly don't they have never been on any foi list of companies who have gone there.

As I said its up to you, but don't name the driver , name the "keeper" on the day in question, don't give this company any ammunition when you don't need to. Always write in the third person for example this
Ref
Date

Dear PCM

I am in receipt of your letter before claim as the registered keeper of (reg num) , we were not responsible for this vehicle on the date of your parking invoice, I wish to name the keeper of this vehicle as

Name
Address

I have now given you a serviceable name and address of the person responsible for the vehicle, and under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 my liability ceases. Any spurious claims to the registered keeper will be defended fully

Sincerely
Your name ( printed)

zzzLazyDaisy

Hi Misterman - this looks like a genuine letter before claim. It looks like the PPC is getting on the LBA / threat of county court action bandwagon.

As they have not yet started proceedings, there is still time to identify the driver, and re-start the POPLA clock. That is certainly what I would do, as a POPLA appeal is infinitely more simple and easy than dealing with a court case - and with a higher prospect of success.

So the first thing I suggest you do is to write to the PPC directly as follows:

---

Dear Sirs

PCN ref xxxxxxxxx
Vehicle reg no XXXXXXXX

I am the Registered Keeper of the vehicle to which the above PCN relates.

The identity and details of the driver on the day in question are:

Name
Address

I refer you to para 5 of PoFA 2012 - as legal proceedings have not yet been started this discharges the Registered Keeper's obligations under PoFA. Any subsequent proceedings that may be issued against me will be defended accordingly, and an application to strike out made on the basis that the claimant has no cause of action against me.

I consider this matter to be closed.

Yours faithfully

PRINT NAME

---

Get this letter off straight away to the PPC. If they have an e-mail address, or a website online appeals service or similar, send it via that method. But given that an LBA has been issued, I would also send it by 1st class post (from the post office get a free certificate of posting).

Does the letter from the solicitor include an e-mail address? Is so send the letter below by e-mail, but wait a few days to allow the letter to the PPC to arrive first (unless you are pushing the 14 day limit for replying to the LBA, in which case send it now). If the solicitor has not provided an e-mail address (or if you prefer not to disclose your own e-mail address) send it by 1st class post from the post office, and get a certificate of posting.

Letter to solicitor:

Dear Sirs

Your reference xxxxxxx

I am writing with regard to your 'letter before action' dated xxxxx

Please note, as the Registered Keeper, I have now identified the driver to your client, as I am entitled to do pursuant to the provisions of PoFA, para 5, since legal proceedings have not yet been commenced. This discharges my obligations as Registered Keeper. Your client no longer has any cause of action against me, and must instead contact the driver.

Accordingly I should be please to receive your confirmation that this matter is now closed.

Yours faithfully

PRINT NAME

misterman

Great info, thanks!

zzzLazyDaisy

No problem - come back if the driver needs help with appealing once the PCN arrives

D

Stroma

I still think this is just smoke from this company, they have never issued before.
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/small_claims_from_bpa_aos_member

And I don't think they will issue any time soon. I just think that Daisy is being to cautious with this, and please not being disrespectful here, but acting to lawyerly.

These companies just rely on intimidation, and their way of operating doesn't fit this profile. Like most of these companies, the anomaly are Parking Eye and CEL, and one or two others.

zzzLazyDaisy

Stroma, I agree with you, but you could say that same about any PPC that has no history of issuing court claims. This solicitor is has stated that they act for the PPC, and they have issued a letter before claim. That is the first step in the court process. Yes, they may be bluffing... but having issued a letter before claim and had no response, they can rely on that LBC months down the line and issue court proceedings out of the blue, with no further notice. They can issue proceedings at any time within 6 years from the date of the 'parking event'.

Personally I don't think it is worth the risk ignoring a letter before claim, when identifying the driver re-sets the POPLA clock and allows them to see it off at POPLA.

Horses for courses.

Either route is valid.

Stroma

Daisy read the letter chain thread, these solicitors have done this before and done nothing, like all of the others for example graham white. They talk a good small claim do these companies, the reality is though they don't go there.

I'm sure the advice you are giving is correct for normal businesses that are actually owed money, but these are vermin and they lie, cheat and swindle to get money, in this instance I would my house on it that they won't go beyond threats.

But it's down to the person who is facing this on what to do, I would like just to put years of experience of dealing with the shenanigans from these parking companies on what they will do next, and that is nothing

Scouse_Magic

misterman wrote: »

Hi, the top of the letter reads:

Re: PCN(NW) LTD, VRM: ****, Total Amount Due: ****

Then the first line reads: 'We act for the above named to whom you are indebted in the sum as stated above for a parking charge as indicated by the PCN (full details overleaf) where you have failed to make payment or give a valid reason for non-payemnt'.

This, I assume, means GBP are writing on behalf of PCN(NW). Also confirmed by the second line: 'We understand that our client's agent Roxburghe (UK) Limited has written to you to request payment to recover the money owed and that you have failed to make any payment despite their requests for you to do so'.

So, it looks like the PPC are the client. The RK was not the driver and the LBC doesn't comply with the Practice Direction. I think I'll write to the PPC and give them the driver's details and send a copy to GBP as advised. Or go down the 'acknowledge LBC / doesn't comply with PD' route?? Thanks for all help so far!

The debt is disputed, and the charge is rejected....If GPB are acting on behalf of their client PCN NW, ask GPB why such a seemingly reputable firm of solicitors have suddenly popped up on the law society's search engine as having an office at the same address as Roxburghe..The very same office address also listed for Michael Sobell T.A. Graham White, both of whom being in very muddy water with the SRA and OFT for firing out the same old garbage unbeknown to the landowners, and that being the case, why did they not take this matter up in the beginning direct from PCN NW instead of Roxburghe being involved adding more costs, all of whom have no interest in the land whatsoever......This stinks

Fire off a complaint to the SRA about the activity currently going on at KT14 6ND and how a debt collector is using a number of solicitors at their address to extract money out of the public when they have no legal right to do so...Under English Contractual Law, Only the actual landowner can bring a claim for damages as a result of a civil trespass or loss of revenue...
As this case has been passed to GPB from Roxburghe NOT PCN NW ask GPB for a copy of their contract with the actual landowner of the car park that allows them to bring legal proceedings against you... When they refuse or will not be able to provide such a document, go to court and ask the judge to dismiss the entire claim and hold them in contempt.

As in the case of VCS Limited V Ibbottson where Simon Renshaw Smith of VCS was summoned to court to explain what legal right VCS had to issue proceedings

misterman

UPdate: court claim form arrived 25/09. I wrote to PCN(NW) first week in August to inform them of the driver's details as the RK was not driving at the time, this was in repsonse to the LBA from GBP. I also wrote to GBP to inform them I had notified PCN(NW) of the driver's details. It's as though this has been ignored, and now court claim has arrived addressed to the RK. I'm about to apply for the Acknowledgement of Service 28 day extension, however, do i tick the 'Contest Jurisdiction' box in addition to the defend claim in full option? One further quick question, as the nature of this case has changed from the original thread title, is it best to create a new thread and link this one, or continue (or could I edit the thread title?) thanks.

zzzLazyDaisy

Stay on this thread so people have easy access to the background.

Re the county court claim this is my advice (hopefully the regulars will be along soon to contribute)

1 go to MCOL and file an acknowledgement of service and extend time for filing a defence to 28 days.

2 write a firm COMPLAINT to the PPC and the Sols and copy it to BPA and DVLA (I will put something up in a minute for the regulars to comment on)

3 Contact the landowner/retailer and COMPLAIN about the harassment from their agents demand that they instruct their agents to cancel this charge and withdraw the court proceedings. See this thread of successes just since august
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4766249

Daisy

Edit - do you still have the original PCN? If so can you confirm the date of the parking event and the date on the PCN please (GPB have had a bit of a run issuing court papers on PCM (NW)'s out of date PCNs)