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Advice needed for despondent youngster!
Hello MSE friends,
I come here (as I often do) looking for advice - and maybe a slight bit of sympathy as well.
I'd like to run you through my story from leaving education to now, at the ripe old age of 22 years old. And let me tell you, I never thought I'd have felt so outcast or frustrated with life.
Now, my story starts at leaving education at 18 YO, I was a top prospect - graduated with 5 A grade A levels, 11 B+ GCSE grades, etc. I was told time and time again I'd be successful by the schools, my family and friends, everyone. I knew in my own mind I'd give it a damn good go, as I'm as motivated as anyone and like many other youngsters, thought of myself as a bit of an entrepreneur.
On completion of college, I was pressured constantly to apply for universities. I decided against it - I could get into debt spending the next three years of my life doing a degree that may or may not actually;
- Be relevant to my career path;
- Help me reach my goals;
- Put me head or shoulders above the hundreds of thousands of students in the same position as me.
No, I was going to go it alone. During the summer I applied for a grand total of 50 jobs - granted, most of them were beyond my skillset, but if you don't ask, you don't get, right?
During this cycle of apply and reject, me and a close friend of mine came up with a great idea for a website. We would approach luxury businesses, barter a % off, sell these products online and take a % rake of the entire sale. As fresh 17 year olds, we approached 3 different banks for funding to learn web development through a course and to allow us to eat for the 6 months we were building the company. Of course due to the financial crisis we were instantly laughed off, despite having a business plan which (even when checking it now and showing established business professionals) was easily viable, and initially almost impossible to make a loss.
If this business model sounds familiar, this is why: Livingsocial established the same year and is currently worth around $3.6 Billion. So that's the first let down.
Then, I decided the right way to go was to spend a year in an apprenticeship learning web development (I still believe that's where the money is) rather than spend three years learning exactly the same skills. Luckily for me I found a real guru of the trade who taught me a lot. However, when initially starting out, I figured there must be some kind of financial help for what was a government-approved project. I was earning £400/month which was pitiful for a full-time job - however I had in writing at least a years extension at £22,000 once the year was up. It seemed simple to me - acquire a small personal loan to live from, and pay it up easily within the next years employment.
Would a bank touch me? Of course they wouldn't. "Your income is far too low" - I know. That's why I'm approaching you with this signed contract from an established company saying the repayments would never become a problem. Second let down from the government and the banks, and one which left me depressed for the entire year, unable to afford to socialise at all for 12 months of my life.
During the year of promised employment I socialised, I bought a car, I didn't have much capital for my next venture: to go freelance/run a small web design company. Back to the banks with yet another well-written business plan. Refused again - too young. Not enough time self-employed and no record of any cashflow. This seemed obvious to me, I was starting a business? Of course I've got no cashflow. Anyway, I was refused again, so borrowed the money from an old friend with a ludicrous repayment plan. I ended up paying about 60% APR on a £3,500 loan.
Just as my business was looking good and I'd paid off my friend - my entire computer system crashes and I'm suddenly unable to do any work or earn any money. With no liquid cash to burn I turned to a credit card. The best I could get: Barclays Initial - 29.9% APR and a £200 maximum credit limit. I was not only insulted but angry, yet I had to take it or risk losing all business. I maxed the card out and took another 'loan shark' fee to replace my systems. I'll tell you now, at this point in my life, I've never felt more alone and depressed. I was definitely on my own.
Since then I've been in a bit of a cycle. I can earn a living, but that's it. This is not what I envisaged myself doing at 22. I can earn just enough to live a basic lifestyle but never more due to not having the capital to advertise my business or even grow it. My credit card is maxed out (they've since upgraded my limit to £800, no change to the 29.9% APR even though I've had it a year and a half 'building my credit profile' which by the way has always been perfect).
I should point out that during my entire life I've never missed a payment. My credit score is perfect, and I have about 4-5 direct debits (mobile phones, etc). All my life I seem to have had finances against me even though I've always played by the rules, so to speak.
However, this is where I need your help!
Finally, I just wish these financial establishments (and 'the government') would stop claiming they're 'lending responsibly' during these times of austerity. I don't know how shooting down proven business plans - let me point you to the $3.6B net worth of Living Social again - and equally offering young people with lesser salaries 29.9% APR credit cards actually counts as responsible lending.
At what point was it ok to offer those who are in a worse financial situation a higher %APR to enable them to borrow money? It seems backwards to me, and is only one step away from the Wongas of this world, which thankfully I've been able to avoid thus far.
Any advice, answers, sympathy, or similar stories would be greatfully received.
I realise there are people out there much worse off than me, but five years of frustration, disgust, anger, perplexion and despondency, I'm beginning to lose the will.
I come here (as I often do) looking for advice - and maybe a slight bit of sympathy as well.
I'd like to run you through my story from leaving education to now, at the ripe old age of 22 years old. And let me tell you, I never thought I'd have felt so outcast or frustrated with life.
Now, my story starts at leaving education at 18 YO, I was a top prospect - graduated with 5 A grade A levels, 11 B+ GCSE grades, etc. I was told time and time again I'd be successful by the schools, my family and friends, everyone. I knew in my own mind I'd give it a damn good go, as I'm as motivated as anyone and like many other youngsters, thought of myself as a bit of an entrepreneur.
On completion of college, I was pressured constantly to apply for universities. I decided against it - I could get into debt spending the next three years of my life doing a degree that may or may not actually;
- Be relevant to my career path;
- Help me reach my goals;
- Put me head or shoulders above the hundreds of thousands of students in the same position as me.
No, I was going to go it alone. During the summer I applied for a grand total of 50 jobs - granted, most of them were beyond my skillset, but if you don't ask, you don't get, right?
During this cycle of apply and reject, me and a close friend of mine came up with a great idea for a website. We would approach luxury businesses, barter a % off, sell these products online and take a % rake of the entire sale. As fresh 17 year olds, we approached 3 different banks for funding to learn web development through a course and to allow us to eat for the 6 months we were building the company. Of course due to the financial crisis we were instantly laughed off, despite having a business plan which (even when checking it now and showing established business professionals) was easily viable, and initially almost impossible to make a loss.
If this business model sounds familiar, this is why: Livingsocial established the same year and is currently worth around $3.6 Billion. So that's the first let down.
Then, I decided the right way to go was to spend a year in an apprenticeship learning web development (I still believe that's where the money is) rather than spend three years learning exactly the same skills. Luckily for me I found a real guru of the trade who taught me a lot. However, when initially starting out, I figured there must be some kind of financial help for what was a government-approved project. I was earning £400/month which was pitiful for a full-time job - however I had in writing at least a years extension at £22,000 once the year was up. It seemed simple to me - acquire a small personal loan to live from, and pay it up easily within the next years employment.
Would a bank touch me? Of course they wouldn't. "Your income is far too low" - I know. That's why I'm approaching you with this signed contract from an established company saying the repayments would never become a problem. Second let down from the government and the banks, and one which left me depressed for the entire year, unable to afford to socialise at all for 12 months of my life.
During the year of promised employment I socialised, I bought a car, I didn't have much capital for my next venture: to go freelance/run a small web design company. Back to the banks with yet another well-written business plan. Refused again - too young. Not enough time self-employed and no record of any cashflow. This seemed obvious to me, I was starting a business? Of course I've got no cashflow. Anyway, I was refused again, so borrowed the money from an old friend with a ludicrous repayment plan. I ended up paying about 60% APR on a £3,500 loan.
Just as my business was looking good and I'd paid off my friend - my entire computer system crashes and I'm suddenly unable to do any work or earn any money. With no liquid cash to burn I turned to a credit card. The best I could get: Barclays Initial - 29.9% APR and a £200 maximum credit limit. I was not only insulted but angry, yet I had to take it or risk losing all business. I maxed the card out and took another 'loan shark' fee to replace my systems. I'll tell you now, at this point in my life, I've never felt more alone and depressed. I was definitely on my own.
Since then I've been in a bit of a cycle. I can earn a living, but that's it. This is not what I envisaged myself doing at 22. I can earn just enough to live a basic lifestyle but never more due to not having the capital to advertise my business or even grow it. My credit card is maxed out (they've since upgraded my limit to £800, no change to the 29.9% APR even though I've had it a year and a half 'building my credit profile' which by the way has always been perfect).
I should point out that during my entire life I've never missed a payment. My credit score is perfect, and I have about 4-5 direct debits (mobile phones, etc). All my life I seem to have had finances against me even though I've always played by the rules, so to speak.
However, this is where I need your help!
- I'm trying to get my finances in order so I was hoping to initially balance-transfer away from my ludicrous credit card. Using the MSE soft-search tool, it seems my likelihood to be accepted is around 20% (I presume my self-employed status and age are working against me again) - I don't want to apply as that will show on my credit report and do me no favours! Any tips or ideas?
- Equally I'm hoping for a personal loan, a business start up loan or something similar to really get my business turning a viable profit. I'm unlikely to be accepted for any of these considering my low cashflow since my business is started (like I said, a vicious cycle considering I need the initial capital to make a decent cashflow!!!) - any ideas here? I want to make this work otherwise I've essentially wasted the last 3 years of my life!
Finally, I just wish these financial establishments (and 'the government') would stop claiming they're 'lending responsibly' during these times of austerity. I don't know how shooting down proven business plans - let me point you to the $3.6B net worth of Living Social again - and equally offering young people with lesser salaries 29.9% APR credit cards actually counts as responsible lending.
At what point was it ok to offer those who are in a worse financial situation a higher %APR to enable them to borrow money? It seems backwards to me, and is only one step away from the Wongas of this world, which thankfully I've been able to avoid thus far.
Any advice, answers, sympathy, or similar stories would be greatfully received.
I realise there are people out there much worse off than me, but five years of frustration, disgust, anger, perplexion and despondency, I'm beginning to lose the will.
0
Comments
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Hello MSE friends,
I come here (as I often do) looking for advice - and maybe a slight bit of sympathy as well.
I'd like to run you through my story from leaving education to now, at the ripe old age of 22 years old. And let me tell you, I never thought I'd have felt so outcast or frustrated with life.
Now, my story starts at leaving education at 18 YO, I was a top prospect - graduated with 5 A grade A levels, 11 B+ GCSE grades, etc. I was told time and time again I'd be successful by the schools, my family and friends, everyone. I knew in my own mind I'd give it a damn good go, as I'm as motivated as anyone and like many other youngsters, thought of myself as a bit of an entrepreneur.
On completion of college, I was pressured constantly to apply for universities. I decided against it - I could get into debt spending the next three years of my life doing a degree that may or may not actually;
- Be relevant to my career path;
- Help me reach my goals;
- Put me head or shoulders above the hundreds of thousands of students in the same position as me.
No, I was going to go it alone. During the summer I applied for a grand total of 50 jobs - granted, most of them were beyond my skillset, but if you don't ask, you don't get, right?
During this cycle of apply and reject, me and a close friend of mine came up with a great idea for a website. We would approach luxury businesses, barter a % off, sell these products online and take a % rake of the entire sale. As fresh 17 year olds, we approached 3 different banks for funding to learn web development through a course and to allow us to eat for the 6 months we were building the company. Of course due to the financial crisis we were instantly laughed off, despite having a business plan which (even when checking it now and showing established business professionals) was easily viable, and initially almost impossible to make a loss.
If this business model sounds familiar, this is why: Livingsocial established the same year and is currently worth around $3.6 Billion. So that's the first let down.
Then, I decided the right way to go was to spend a year in an apprenticeship learning web development (I still believe that's where the money is) rather than spend three years learning exactly the same skills. Luckily for me I found a real guru of the trade who taught me a lot. However, when initially starting out, I figured there must be some kind of financial help for what was a government-approved project. I was earning £400/month which was pitiful for a full-time job - however I had in writing at least a years extension at £22,000 once the year was up. It seemed simple to me - acquire a small personal loan to live from, and pay it up easily within the next years employment.
Would a bank touch me? Of course they wouldn't. "Your income is far too low" - I know. That's why I'm approaching you with this signed contract from an established company saying the repayments would never become a problem. Second let down from the government and the banks, and one which left me depressed for the entire year, unable to afford to socialise at all for 12 months of my life.
During the year of promised employment I socialised, I bought a car, I didn't have much capital for my next venture: to go freelance/run a small web design company. Back to the banks with yet another well-written business plan. Refused again - too young. Not enough time self-employed and no record of any cashflow. This seemed obvious to me, I was starting a business? Of course I've got no cashflow. Anyway, I was refused again, so borrowed the money from an old friend with a ludicrous repayment plan. I ended up paying about 60% APR on a £3,500 loan.
Just as my business was looking good and I'd paid off my friend - my entire computer system crashes and I'm suddenly unable to do any work or earn any money. With no liquid cash to burn I turned to a credit card. The best I could get: Barclays Initial - 29.9% APR and a £200 maximum credit limit. I was not only insulted but angry, yet I had to take it or risk losing all business. I maxed the card out and took another 'loan shark' fee to replace my systems. I'll tell you now, at this point in my life, I've never felt more alone and depressed. I was definitely on my own.
Since then I've been in a bit of a cycle. I can earn a living, but that's it. This is not what I envisaged myself doing at 22. I can earn just enough to live a basic lifestyle but never more due to not having the capital to advertise my business or even grow it. My credit card is maxed out (they've since upgraded my limit to £800, no change to the 29.9% APR even though I've had it a year and a half 'building my credit profile' which by the way has always been perfect).
I should point out that during my entire life I've never missed a payment. My credit score is perfect, and I have about 4-5 direct debits (mobile phones, etc). All my life I seem to have had finances against me even though I've always played by the rules, so to speak.
However, this is where I need your help!- I'm trying to get my finances in order so I was hoping to initially balance-transfer away from my ludicrous credit card. Using the MSE soft-search tool, it seems my likelihood to be accepted is around 20% (I presume my self-employed status and age are working against me again) - I don't want to apply as that will show on my credit report and do me no favours! Any tips or ideas?
- Equally I'm hoping for a personal loan, a business start up loan or something similar to really get my business turning a viable profit. I'm unlikely to be accepted for any of these considering my low cashflow since my business is started (like I said, a vicious cycle considering I need the initial capital to make a decent cashflow!!!) - any ideas here? I want to make this work otherwise I've essentially wasted the last 3 years of my life!
Finally, I just wish these financial establishments (and 'the government') would stop claiming they're 'lending responsibly' during these times of austerity. I don't know how shooting down proven business plans - let me point you to the $3.6B net worth of Living Social again - and equally offering young people with lesser salaries 29.9% APR credit cards actually counts as responsible lending.
At what point was it ok to offer those who are in a worse financial situation a higher %APR to enable them to borrow money? It seems backwards to me, and is only one step away from the Wongas of this world, which thankfully I've been able to avoid thus far.
Any advice, answers, sympathy, or similar stories would be greatfully received.
I realise there are people out there much worse off than me, but five years of frustration, disgust, anger, perplexion and despondency, I'm beginning to lose the will.
For a start dont lose the will.
Good luck with it.0 -
I would suggest it is because you are trying to leapfrog right over the "learning from experience" phase of life.
You're trying to go straight from Education into a successful business with plenty of cash rolling in.
Life isn't like that, as you are discovering.
Take a job, any job. Get a regular income and start saving. Squirrel as much money away as possible whilst building your business model at home in your spare time.
Once you have the funds in place (at least half of what you are looking to invest) approach the banks with your business plan.
By this time your credit file looks great, lots of traffic, lots of accounts, all managed well.
You can't guarantee acceptance, but you can reduce their reasons for rejection.
All seems a lot of hard work and will take ages doesn't it?
Thats life.0 -
What Apples2 said is correct.
You need to learn to be a little more realistic. Nobody was going to lend you money at 17 no matter what your business plan was.
Unless you are paying off the full amount on your cc every month you won't have a great credit history. Your card is maxed out and you keep applying for more credit.
Get a job and work on your business in your spare time. It's what most other people have done. Nobody owes you a living. If you really have a great idea you'll find a way.0 -
I would suggest it is because you are trying to leapfrog right over the "learning from experience" phase of life.
You're trying to go straight from Education into a successful business with plenty of cash rolling in.
Life isn't like that, as you are discovering.
Take a job, any job. Get a regular income and start saving. Squirrel as much money away as possible whilst building your business model at home in your spare time.
Once you have the funds in place (at least half of what you are looking to invest) approach the banks with your business plan.
By this time your credit file looks great, lots of traffic, lots of accounts, all managed well.
You can't guarantee acceptance, but you can reduce their reasons for rejection.
All seems a lot of hard work and will take ages doesn't it?
Thats life.
I appreciate what you're saying and I can understand how it might seem like that, but my point was less a complaint of how things are hard on startup, it's more that ten years(?) ago I'd have been able to approach the bank with exactly the same business plan and practically pluck a figure out of thin air to borrow.
I've got three written contracts as my business stands that add up to just over £20k/yearly, my overheads are currently only my internet bill (and of course petrol, etc and the imponderables) so at least 90% of that is profit, and that's not to mention the extra (smaller) jobs I'm likely to get through word of mouth. A £5k business loan for advertisement and expansion is hardly a great ask when you consider these factors.
My annoyance is that they plug in 'Self-employed', '22' into their system and it instantly says no regardless of mitigating factors.
My business plan works and has worked for the last two years without a blip, it just doesn't make sense to me when I've got a perfect five year credit history.
I do appreciate your thoughts and it might likely come to a point where I will take that advice happily. However, it's quite an enveloping thing to say and at the risk of sounding naive, people like Zuckerberg weren't willing to play the waiting game and have been rewarded as a result of it.
If I'd have started seeking personal investment for our initial plan, I might possibly be in Livingsocial's shoes (even though they're currently making a loss), or at least competing. It seems 'the system' is shutting out the younger genere.0 -
The same logic can be applied to Car Insurance, the under 25's are hit hardest, because they are statistically most likely to have some kind of event.It seems 'the system' is shutting out the younger genere.
In Zopa you used to choose who you would lend money to, A*, A, B etc (A* being people with unblemished credit files). Bottom of the pile was Y, which stood for YOUNG.
The lenders could choose not to lend money to them as they are statistically most likely to default.
Like I said earlier, that's life.0 -
For a new business?it's more that ten years(?) ago I'd have been able to approach the bank with exactly the same business plan and practically pluck a figure out of thin air to borrow.
No chance.0 -
Would you consider taking on a partner in your business - preferably someone older with a bit of business experience - and then look for the loan againWeight loss challenge, lose 15lb in 6 weeks before Christmas.0
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I've got three written contracts as my business stands that add up to just over £20k/yearly, my overheads are currently only my internet bill (and of course petrol, etc and the imponderables) so at least 90% of that is profit, and that's not to mention the extra (smaller) jobs I'm likely to get through word of mouth. A £5k business loan for advertisement and expansion is hardly a great ask when you consider these factors.
I'm assuming that you live off the remaining money - ie it's your wages, not profit. Clearly your business isn't turning what any bank would deem a profit - hence you've no cash in the bank to repair equipment and are unable to reduce a £800 credit card...If someone can't clear an £800 debt (in fact, it seems to be growing) , how many mitigating factors would you need to lend them £5k?
For light entertainment, have a read of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LivingSocial - the first couple of paragraphs should show you why they were able to get the idea off the ground and your weren't...they were a group of experienced professionals with a proven track record of producing successful products. The took tens of millions of investment to make a go of it. You really need to understand the mechanics of why a bank wasn't going to lend you that much money.
There's a reason you're able to name-drop people like Zuckerberg, Gates, Jobs, Sugar, Branson et al - there are only a handful of people who've ever managed to go it alone...it's far from the "usual" model - and there are hundreds of thousands of successful companies out there where you can't name the founder and it wasn't successful overnight. By thinking you're going to be one of the former, you're greatly reducing your chances of becoming the latter.
You can make good money in web development (certainly much better than your own venture is paying at present, with much better stability) - and you'll likely have time to work on "something big" in your spare time. Make no mistake, £20k really isn't a lot in the business world, if you're taking on jobs even smaller than that, the day-to-day noise is going to stop you developing anything that will "make it big" - you'd be much better off getting a clean 9-5 to pay your rent, then spending evenings and weekends on focussed development.0 -
Consider reading this book:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B009U1U2IU/ref=docs-os-doi_0Alexander Sokol
"Mastery" is the word Greene uses to describe the state of being characterized by stepping beyond mere understanding of a topic, instead obtaining superior command over it, yielding intuitive understanding, integration of manifold ideas and resulting in a major increase in creative output. In his book, Greene sets out to understand the nature of mastery, in particularly seeking to provide a practical guide for how to attain mastery.0
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