Blame the Banks or The Government?

Glen_Clark

Well whatever you think of Gordon Brown he topped the list of MP's earnings with over £7m last session and gave it all to charity. He has rejected his Prime Ministerial Pension and accepts only the basic MP's salary. How many politicians would do that http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/gordon-brown/10083547/Gordon-Brown-tops-list-of-MPs-with-extra-earnings.html
For all his failings I certainly would rather have Gordon Brown that the slimeball we have got - Patrick Mercer who would even work for the Fijian Dictatorship to line his own pockets. I cannot imagine worse sleaze than that. And he is still my MP:mad:

ColdIron

Glen_Clark wrote: »

and accepts only the basic MP's salary. How many politicians would do that

Most other MPs have the good grace to turn up at the HoC to represent their constituents and take part in the parliamentary process. I'd say he was rather overpaid

talexuser

Glen_Clark wrote: »

No wonder they were annoyed when Brown took that away from them.

And also contributed to the demise of good final salary schemes, which also lost their tax advantages. You can't argue that a policy that threw the baby out with the bathwater was good because you got rid of some bathwater.

talexuser

Glen_Clark wrote: »

and gave it all to charity.

They actually say went to "running his office" and charitable donations. Maybe it's Brown's way of seeking absolution for the mess he made for the rest of us. Blair's method was a lot easier - become a catholic and get forgiven no problem. :rotfl:

Archi_Bald

talexuser wrote: »

And also contributed to the demise of good final salary schemes

The loss of all (not just 'good') final salary pension schemes is not specific to the UK, and you can hardly blame any government for the loss since these schemes were industry schemes. To say industry can't afford final salary pension schemes because the government isn't giving them enough tax relief is a bit naiive - - - firstly, who would fund that tax relief, and secondly, tax reliefs are almost irrelevant to the performance of a pensions fund. Pension funds are subject to market forces.

grey_gym_sock

Thrugelmir wrote: »

Created a real divide between public sector and private sector though.

pension schemes have been becoming less generous in both public and private sectors, albeit not at exactly the same speed, and not for exactly the same reasons.

some politicians have been trying get support (from private-sector workers) for cutting back on public-sector pensions by suggesting that the public sector is being treated more generously. this is not very accurate, however. often, the public sector has lower salaries but better pensions: you have to compare the whole package. and public sector pay remains lower for comparable jobs.

grey_gym_sock

talexuser wrote: »

I'd be gladder without both this level of debt and never having had the "prudent" Gordon Brown.

you're dodging the issues. you can't complain about both the higher deficit and the (stealth) tax rises. making 1 of them better makes the other worse. it's a trade-off. that's what government should be about.

("should" because sometimes its actually about enriching the politicians and their friends.)

Old_Slaphead

grey_gym_sock wrote: »

and public sector pay remains lower for comparable jobs.

Can you provide evidence to support that?

talexuser

grey_gym_sock wrote: »

you can't complain about both the higher deficit and the (stealth) tax rises

That's assuming another government would have ended up with the same high deficit as Browns'. A competent government would not have. Which is not to say the Tories would not have, their deregulation mania may possibly have led to a worse crunch by letting the banks rip with their fraud even more. But Brown remains the disaster because he was in charge and responsible for the policies and the regulation, and will for ever be remembered as such.

Glen_Clark

talexuser wrote: »

That's assuming another government would have ended up with the same high deficit as Browns'. A competent government would not have. Which is not to say the Tories would not have, their deregulation mania may possibly have led to a worse crunch by letting the banks rip with their fraud even more. But Brown remains the disaster because he was in charge and responsible for the policies and the regulation, and will for ever be remembered as such.

True, the deregulation that led to the disaster began under Thatcher. But Thatcher had far higher North Sea Oil Revenues and one-off income from Privatisations to hide her deficit.