Advice needed desperately please - "benefit fraud"

dreamyseahorse

I did not make judgment, I posted facts.

Who told her she could/ should make a deed of variation? Did they also tell her she did not need to declare the change in circumstances? Ignorance of the system is no defence - every award letter will have stated that she must declare any change in circumstance.

She was drinking heavily at the time and she does not remember who told her to do a deed of variation (something she didnt know about before), it was done by the people who dealt with the estate? Anyway I do know that ignorance is not really a defense but I just want to get across that she really did not do this to intentially deprive herself in order to continue benefits but rather to deprive herself of a huge amount of money when she was a mess and give it to her children rather than drink it, she thought this was the right thing to do....
Agreed it was stupid but what is done is done and I am just trying to help her as best I can....

dreamyseahorse

She committed fraud - she pays the price, imprisonment I hope where she can sober up.

Ahhhh thanks, great advice there, really what I asked for ...did you not read that she is 18 months sober and fair play to her with all this going on.

dreamyseahorse

Thank you very much for the advice and link Housing Benefit Officer, I will look into this.

skintmacflint

dreamyseahorse wrote: »

she is 18 months sober and fair play to her with all this going on.

Certainly this is to be congratulated and hopefully with the ongoing support of her family can continue.

Is it possible for her to find some or any type of paying work, now her condition is stable? Even something part time at nmw would be better than her present zero income.?

MacMickster

skintmacflint wrote: »

Is it possible for her to find some or any type of paying work, now her condition is stable? Even something part time at nmw would be better than her present zero income.?

I'm surprised at this is the the first mention on this thread of actually working for an income rather than claiming benefits.

There is no point at all in agonising over what your mother should have done. She did what she did, and that can't be undone.

One of your sisters has suggested that Mum moves in with her. This is probably the best option, with Mum looking for work to enable her to contribute to household expenses. This, along with her winning the battle against alcoholism, may help to convince a judge that she has started taking responsibility for herself and her actions.

paddedjohn

jacques_chirac wrote: »

As a family you had £64,000. Surely you have not spent it all?

I fail to see what advice you want. Your mother intentionally deprived herself of capital and failed to advise of a change in circumstances. She needs to accept her punishment, and the rest of the family need to find a way to support her financially.

Just pointing out that as a family they actually had £82,000. 4 kids got £18k each and the mum kept £10k.

BurnleyBob

I don't get how a solicitor informed the mother that she has a defence and is pleading not guilty because having a guilty verdict returned would lose many Brownie points with the judge. I can only imagine that the mitigation must revolve around the someone who advised her to make a Deed of Variation and that someone is a professional legal person who was aware of her circumstances with regards to capital and savings thresholds for those in receipt of the means tested benefits that she claimed.

In the absence of evidence to support that wrong advice, she would be wise to plead guilty and make a huge play of her drink problems around the time of the will's variation.

Jobseeeker

she has been sober 18 months, is she regularly going to AA or something like that, this will look good in her defence. It will also look good if she is in employment when it goes to trial

go back and find out about these people who dealt with the estate, paper work? contact the firm of solicitors. Perhaps they will help you out. She was an alcoholic and was given bad advice the judge might take this into consideration

princessdon

You think it is harsh I said that, perhaps so, yes I missed that she is now sober, sincere congratulations to her for that and I pray no relapses in the future, its a horrible addiction and I know from my own family the damage it does.

But

Why a deed of variation? She could have gifted money anytime, there was no need if not either attempting to remove taxation or keep benefits. Example when my grandad died each grandchild was given £3,000 - my brother like your mum said he'd inject and probably OD, he needed to sign a document saying he wanted his portion to go to his children (this was in case in the future he complained we didn't give it and when under the influence he's capable of forgetting what he wanted). When he received another small inheritance (not willed) he just asked to send to kids bank accounts. I can't see why your mum took that route if not trying to hide something, it was hers, she can give away, why use a variation deed?

Also it's your mum and you love her, I don't, neither will the jury. She failed to inform the benefit people, she didn't put your sisters money into a trust she couldn't access, she didn't declare use of that money or the £10,000. This was over a long period of time, even when sober she didn't try to make amends, though I suspect she will have acknowledged to your sister she will make amends, not once to the benefit agency.

If she was so incapacitated due to her addiction then why did no one try to assist with this? Why did her advisor allow her to make decisions whilst incapable, were social services involved as she had a young child at home.

To you as her daughter you see no dishonesty (who does, we love them), to others we see very much that although I feel sure she was not in the right frame of mind to make such major decisions, keeping benefits was a reason she did what she did.

If you genuinely feel she was unable to make her own decisions due to mental impairment then your point of call is the advisor who you say misadvised and failed to ensure she understood the consequences.

On a practical note if your sister is 18 she can claim benefits, perhaps this would help in the mean time as it will cover some bills, especially if a joint tenancy can be arranged (its in the interests of the landlord).

You should also get advice re the eviction and ensure the landlord followed procedures etc.

Sorry but I don't see why people awaiting trial for benefit fraud should be paid benefits, but your sister is 100% innocent and as such she should continue to be supported in anyway possible.

Caz3121

have they said how much she has been overpaid due to this - I would expect 8 years of housing and council tax benefit alone to be a significant amount. £50k+?