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Help please re: response to letter from PPC.
Ellie007
Posts: 181 Forumite
Dear all,
I have previously posted on behalf of a friend who received a notice after being caught stopped outside Stansted airpost in a no stopping zone. It was a hire car, the hire car provided Empark UK with my friend's details, and he received a copy of the parking charge outside the relevant timeframe. We responded with the following:
I refer you to your correspondence received on xxxxx
I am writing to inform you that the original Notice to Keeper is invalid as it invokes POFA 2012 and in particular the timescales laid down in law i.e. Section 9 of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012.
This states that this notice must be delivered within the relevant period, which in this case is 14 days as per Section 9 (5). Time of 'Incident' is noted as xxxx February 2013 and the notice was issued on xxxx April 2013. This fails to comply with the correct timescales.
Furthermore, if the letter that you subsequently sent to me is deemed to be a Notice to Hirer, you have furthermore failed to adhere to POFA 2012 and in particular the timescales under Section 14 (5) (c).
Please would you cancel this invoice forthwith, or issue a POPLA code by return so that I can take this matter further.
We have now received this response:
We understand from your letter that you are challenging the PCN. The date of the alleged incidnet was xxx Feb 2013, parking charge notice was issued 8th April 13 - we do operate with AOS code of practice for Parking Enforcement. We comply with the sections 18 to 24 of COP - Private Parking Management followed by POFA 2012- Schedule 4. Specific parking terms signage tells drivers what our terms and conditions are, including our parking charges. A driver who uses our car park does so under contract with us.
When entering Stansted Airport Limited premises the driver accepts them. Parking / Stopping in the main road is without our permission which is an act of trespass. Our ANPR vehicle is used to control and enforce parking in private car parks.
We have requested the data from DVLA on xxx Feb 13 (timescale maximum 28 days after the offence - confirmed by BPA) and recieved details back from them on xxx April 2013 (DVLA has no time scale limitations).
Stansted Airport Limited of course has a duty to make drivers aware of any parking restrictions that are in operation. This is done so by way of street signs saying ' Not stopping at any time to pick up or drop off. CCTV and number plate recognition in operation. Warning enforcement charge of £75. This is private road'. AND SO ON AND SO FORTH - JUST BLURB ABOUT HOW TARIFFS ARE DISPLAYED AND HOW IT IS ALL IN THE NAME OF SAFETY (can't be bothered to type the rest).
Please provide us with the PCN number so that we can issue you a verification code for Poplar (their spelling).
So....what next? The letter seems 9/10ths garbage? And doesn't answer the point about the NTK being outside timescales?
Please help, all you clever people!!!!!
El xx
I have previously posted on behalf of a friend who received a notice after being caught stopped outside Stansted airpost in a no stopping zone. It was a hire car, the hire car provided Empark UK with my friend's details, and he received a copy of the parking charge outside the relevant timeframe. We responded with the following:
I refer you to your correspondence received on xxxxx
I am writing to inform you that the original Notice to Keeper is invalid as it invokes POFA 2012 and in particular the timescales laid down in law i.e. Section 9 of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012.
This states that this notice must be delivered within the relevant period, which in this case is 14 days as per Section 9 (5). Time of 'Incident' is noted as xxxx February 2013 and the notice was issued on xxxx April 2013. This fails to comply with the correct timescales.
Furthermore, if the letter that you subsequently sent to me is deemed to be a Notice to Hirer, you have furthermore failed to adhere to POFA 2012 and in particular the timescales under Section 14 (5) (c).
Please would you cancel this invoice forthwith, or issue a POPLA code by return so that I can take this matter further.
We have now received this response:
We understand from your letter that you are challenging the PCN. The date of the alleged incidnet was xxx Feb 2013, parking charge notice was issued 8th April 13 - we do operate with AOS code of practice for Parking Enforcement. We comply with the sections 18 to 24 of COP - Private Parking Management followed by POFA 2012- Schedule 4. Specific parking terms signage tells drivers what our terms and conditions are, including our parking charges. A driver who uses our car park does so under contract with us.
When entering Stansted Airport Limited premises the driver accepts them. Parking / Stopping in the main road is without our permission which is an act of trespass. Our ANPR vehicle is used to control and enforce parking in private car parks.
We have requested the data from DVLA on xxx Feb 13 (timescale maximum 28 days after the offence - confirmed by BPA) and recieved details back from them on xxx April 2013 (DVLA has no time scale limitations).
Stansted Airport Limited of course has a duty to make drivers aware of any parking restrictions that are in operation. This is done so by way of street signs saying ' Not stopping at any time to pick up or drop off. CCTV and number plate recognition in operation. Warning enforcement charge of £75. This is private road'. AND SO ON AND SO FORTH - JUST BLURB ABOUT HOW TARIFFS ARE DISPLAYED AND HOW IT IS ALL IN THE NAME OF SAFETY (can't be bothered to type the rest).
Please provide us with the PCN number so that we can issue you a verification code for Poplar (their spelling).
So....what next? The letter seems 9/10ths garbage? And doesn't answer the point about the NTK being outside timescales?
Please help, all you clever people!!!!!
El xx
0
Comments
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Doesn't seem to me that the PPC can get its head around the PoFA-dictated timescales, so don't waste any more breath on them.
Get the POPLA(R - :rotfl:) code, get an appeal sorted, with help from here, and let POPLA tell them how it is.Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0 -
They are really calling it an offence ? lol , that is something to put into the popla appeal as its misrepresentation of authority . Just write back to them with the fake ticket number (call it that as well
) . wonder why they need it as obviously they are writing to you? When posting a parking issue on MSE do not reveal any information that may enable PPCs to identify you. They DO monitor the forum.
We don't need the following to help you.
Name, Address, PCN Number, Exact Date Of Incident, Date On Invoice, Reg Number, Vehicle Picture, The Time You Entered & Left Car Park, Or The Amount of Time You Overstayed.
:beer: Anti Enforcement Hobbyist Member :beer:0 -
"An act of trespass" :cool: Maybe worth £1 to them if they wish to take you to court!0
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They can only possibly continue with this aimed at the driver then. So in ALL your reponses, including to POPLA, write in the third person as the registered keeper. Do not imply who was driving at all and they can go nowhere with this.
But I would demand the POPLA code from them so give them the ticket number and tell them that the registered keeper will be appealing to POPLA. Then get some help here to fine-tune your appeal points and wording (carefully written).PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
Ok - update!
The parking company has now emailed him a number that appears to be the POPLA verification number. What now?!!!
What grounds are we appealing on, and what is the timescale in which we do it (he leaves for overseas for a whole year in a couple of weeks time so need to sort a.s.a.p....).
Would be really grateful for help please!0 -
Ok - update!
The parking company has now emailed him a number that appears to be the POPLA verification number. What now?!!!
What grounds are we appealing on, and what is the timescale in which we do it (he leaves for overseas for a whole year in a couple of weeks time so need to sort a.s.a.p....).
Would be really grateful for help please!
Glad you've now got the POPLA code, so on the way to getting this sorted.
Do a bit of reading and get up to speed on what a POPLA Appeal should contain. Here is a post with a number of links to a variety of well developed POPLA appeals to start with. You can copy and paste any of the paragraphs, adapted to your circumstances, to commence your draft.
Once you've made a start on the draft come back and let us have a look at it and we'll help fine tune it:
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=61646505&postcount=2
HTH
Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0
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