Time off for dependents

zzzLazyDaisy

Hi Kittie, thanks for the update, and yes please do keep us informed. Employers are a lot like children... they always think they are the first to come up with the latest wheeze, when in fact it is usually the same old argument dressed up in a different set of clothes!

:-)

ILW

You can see why employers prefer to take on young single Eastern Europeans. Reduces the chances of having to deal with these sort of issues.

liney

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

Hi Kittie, thanks for the update, and yes please do keep us informed. Employers are a lot like children... they always think they are the first to come up with the latest wheeze, when in fact it is usually the same old argument dressed up in a different set of clothes!

:-)

It is my understanding that a company can take action if the employee is absent for what they deem an unacceptable amount of occassions. Otherwise any parent could effectively take time off weekly/monthly to deal with 'emergency childcare' for the day.

MrHR

kittiej wrote: »

Hi everyone, I just wanted to know some thoughts please.

If an employer includes time off to deal with dependents in an emergency situation in the Bradford formula calculations would this not leave the employer open to a potential sex discrimination claim?

I realise that 'dependent' covers more than children but since it would normally be the mother having to deal with an ill child and not the father then it seems a bit unfair to me.

Interesting viewpoint but the fact that men or women can apply for dependency leave rules out sex discrimination - Also it's a statistical fact that most single parents are women etc, so as such they are more likely to apply for it however this is not Employers saying who can and can't apply it's just the way it is!

The laws to flexible working requests are changing soon to allow anyone for any reason to apply for flexible working so it will be interesting to see what comes of that!

Missme

MrHR wrote: »

Interesting viewpoint but the fact that men or women can apply for dependency leave rules out sex discrimination - Also it's a statistical fact that most single parents are women etc, so as such they are more likely to apply for it however this is not Employers saying who can and can't apply it's just the way it is!

The laws to flexible working requests are changing soon to allow anyone for any reason to apply for flexible working so it will be interesting to see what comes of that!

WADR, I think what you're saying about access to dependancy leave/no discrimination is nonsense.

It's not applying for it that is the issue it's the penalty attached to using it that disproportionally affects women because women are the main care-givers.

zzzLazyDaisy

liney wrote: »

It is my understanding that a company can take action if the employee is absent for what they deem an unacceptable amount of occassions. Otherwise any parent could effectively take time off weekly/monthly to deal with 'emergency childcare' for the day.

But then it wouldn't be an unforeseen emergency so as to bring them within the legislation. If an 'emergency' is cropping up every week, requiring the employee to have time off work to deal with it, the regularity means that the parent is failing to take proper steps to put in place adequate child care and back up. So in that case it would not be the reliance on a statutory right that would be the issue, but an abuse of the procedure. Following proper investigations and procedures, that could lead to a disciplinary, but it is a totally different situation from routinely penalising employees for relying on their statutory rights.

Look at it this way.... an employee who is pregnant may have time off for ante-natal appointments and will have time off on maternity leave. Those absences would normally trigger a review, but because the employee is relying on a statutory right to have time off in those circumstances, and it would be discriminatory to penalise the employee, absences relating to pregnancy and maternity leave are excluded.

liney

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

But then it wouldn't be an unforeseen emergency so as to bring them within the legislation. If an 'emergency' is cropping up every week, requiring the employee to have time off work to deal with it, the regularity means that the parent is failing to take proper steps to put in place adequate child care and back up. So in that case it would not be the reliance on a statutory right that would be the issue, but an abuse of the procedure. Following proper investigations and procedures, that could lead to a disciplinary, but it is a totally different situation from routinely penalising employees for relying on their statutory rights.

So one might say that if anyone is having enough time off for Dependents to make a huge difference to their Bradford Factor, then they are in fact taking abusing proceedure because they shouldn't really be absent for more than a couple of instances a year.

I think the issue is that because the legislation spouts on about 'reasonable,' and doesn't say 'maximium of 3 instances per year,' (for example)

skintandscared_2

This page clearly sets out the legal entitlement to parental leave - which is unpaid leave for emergency time off for children up to a certain age. This time off should NOT be included in the Bradford calculations as it is unpaid time off that parents are legally entitled to!

https://www.gov.uk/parental-leave/entitlement

liney

skintandscared wrote: »

This page clearly sets out the legal entitlement to parental leave - which is unpaid leave for emergency time off for children up to a certain age. This time off should NOT be included in the Bradford calculations as it is unpaid time off that parents are legally entitled to!

https://www.gov.uk/parental-leave/entitlement

Except Parental Leave is not the same thing a Emergency Dependent Leave.

Parental Leave is booked and agreed in advance.

Emergency Dependent Leave is supposed to be for unforseen circumstances involving a person who is dependent upon you. http://www.ivillage.co.uk/faq-time-dependents-emergency-family-leave/83312

skintandscared_2

liney wrote: »

Except Parental Leave is not the same thing a Emergency Dependent Leave.

Parental Leave is booked and agreed in advance.

Emergency Dependent Leave is supposed to be for unforseen circumstances involving a person who is dependent upon you. http://www.ivillage.co.uk/faq-time-dependents-emergency-family-leave/83312

Err, not always. I have had calls from staff who need an emergency day off for their children and have taken it as parental leave. There has been no notice at all.