All in one pc vs replacement tower- advice please

Mr_Toad

Lum wrote: »

While this is true, the point is about the ability to repair and replace things as the system ages.

Ultimately, for most "normal" home computer users, modern PCs have reached a point that an upgrade should pretty much never be necessary.

In your original post you advise against all in one PCs because they use proprietary or laptop parts then go on to say the OP would be better of with a tower or laptop?

I would also challenge your view on why PC sales are declining. People aren't necessarily, as you suggest, using their old PCs rather than buying new. Most of my friends have mothballed or dumped their PCs and not replaced them and in every case this is because they now do most of what they need on their smartphones. Those that need something with a bigger screen, to shop on-line or whatever, buy a tablet. Gone are the days when you needed a PC to get on-line and access email and I think that is one of the many reasons PCs are in decline.

Only two friends now have a PC and both for specific reasons, one is studying for a degree and the other writes a newsletter and keeps an archive of data for a local historical society.

Without exception all of the teenage children of those friends do their gaming on consoles.

Lum

Mr_Toad wrote: »

In your original post you advise against all in one PCs because they use proprietary or laptop parts then go on to say the OP would be better of with a tower or laptop?

Tower: Uses standard easily replacable parts. Not easily portable as requires a mains supply and a desk.
Laptop: Uses proprietary or expensive parts, but is also easily portable, can be used on battery on the sofa.
AIO: Uses proprietary or expensive parts, but not easily portable as requires a mains supply and a desk.

The AIO really is the worst of both worlds.

I would also challenge your view on why PC sales are declining. People aren't necessarily, as you suggest, using their old PCs rather than buying new. Most of my friends have mothballed or dumped their PCs and not replaced them and in every case this is because they now do most of what they need on their smartphones. Those that need something with a bigger screen, to shop on-line or whatever, buy a tablet. Gone are the days when you needed a PC to get on-line and access email and I think that is one of the many reasons PCs are in decline.

Isn't anecdata fun Most of my friends and relatives, those who aren't gamers, are sticking with their old PCs as they do everything they need. Many businesses are doing the same thing. Personally I find tablets and phones much less convenient for using the internet, except for when I'm out and about.

Without exception all of the teenage children of those friends do their gaming on consoles.

I specifically didn't address gaming as that's a more specialist interest. Those who use their PCs for gaming generally know what they want and don't come onto MSE asking if an AIO system is a good idea.

IcyEars

chocolatepennyfarthing wrote: »

PC about to die

In what way is it about to die? It may be far cheaper to fix\repair the old one than shell out for a new one.

(and LUM, I used to love my light pen on my CPC464 although it did give you arm ache - might have to see if my mother has it in her attic next time I am down!)

bluesnake

Lum wrote: »

Tower: Uses standard easily replacable parts. Not easily portable as requires a mains supply and a desk.
Laptop: Uses proprietary or expensive parts, but is also easily portable, can be used on battery on the sofa.
AIO: Uses proprietary or expensive parts, but not easily portable as requires a mains supply and a desk.

It is getting worse. Now some manufactures will only let you use certain hardware. This is due manufactures greed, want you to only buy their product, and not a 3rd party products, so the put device lookup tables in the bios and are called 'WhiteList check'.

Then there is a SLIC check, not the normal MS license one, but one which only allows you to install the os family that you have bought for the machine. When a new os comes out, you probably will have to buy another machine, because the bios says no.

macman

GunJack wrote: »

the main reason that all-in-ones sell is that people (who in the main, don't appreciate the technical aspects) think wow..... they are over-priced, prone to overheating and therefore breaking, and are built in such a way that repairing them if/when something goes on them is a bl00dy nightmare...wouldn't touch one with a bargepole...

Unless it's an iMac of course.
(Ducks quickly down below the parapet)...

Lum

^^^ People who want an iMac know they want an iMac and aren't buying based on price vs performance. They are buying because they want a machine that looks stylish and has a nice OS that isn't Windows. That is fine, it's not the cheapest option but iMacs are good kit if you have the money. This doesn't apply to Windows-based AIO systems, which will inevitably be compared to the iMac and lose.

Note: I'm not an Apple fangirl. I don't own a single apple product and don't intend to. I do, however, recognise why people like them, and can respect that.

bluesnake wrote: »

Then there is a SLIC check, not the normal MS license one, but one which only allows you to install the os family that you have bought for the machine. When a new os comes out, you probably will have to buy another machine, because the bios says no.

That's not how SLIC works. It's a process to allow manufacturers to automate the OS install by not having them have to enter a product key by hand into every PC they sell. If you want to install a new OS then you can but you'll need to enter the product key.

You might be getting it confused with "secure boot" which is a new thing that does indeed only allow you to boot the OS allowed by the BIOS however Microsoft require that manufacturers give you the option to disable this or they won't certify the machine as compatible with Windows 8.

Secure boot is not actually a bad thing, despite all the scaremongering that's been going on out there. There's some malware out there that works by actually replacing your OS, possibly then running the OS in a virtual machine, or just replacing part of your OS at the boot level. In both cases it does this to hide itself from virus checkers. Secure boot helps to protect against this by refusing to boot an unauthorised or modifies OS.

Mr_Toad

Lum wrote: »

The AIO really is the worst of both worlds.

Clearly a personal view and obviously true for you but there are a lot of people on this planet that aren't you.

The only correct choice of PC is the one that works best for each individual and only they can decide what that is.

I always advise people to look at all the alternatives and then choose. I make no observation on what is better or worse than anything else, I wouldn't presume.

I think your comment that people who buy an iMac are doing so because "They are buying because they want a machine that looks stylish and has a nice OS that isn't Windows." is so condescending it beggars belief. How can you possible know why anyone buys anything.

Lum

Well I did suggest that if space was an issue then an AIO may be worthwhile.

As for the iMac comment, what I was getting at is that there are good reasons for buying one. OSX is a good OS and their hardware is very nice looking. What they don't offer (IMO) is value for money, but for some the price premium is worth it.

All I was really trying to say is that bringing up the iMac in a thread like this is a bit of a red herring.

bluesnake

Lum wrote: »

That's not how SLIC works. It's a process to allow manufacturers to automate the OS install by not having them have to enter a product key by hand into every PC they sell. If you want to install a new OS then you can but you'll need to enter the product key.

You might be getting it confused with "secure boot"

Sorry, I interpreted the article wrong, and should have read the extra SLIC pages on the forum too. SLIC portion is only for activation.

WhiteList in the bios controls which companies replacement nic will work. Could be expanded to graphics cards, and others though.

Secure boot is a PITA, have it on my laptop:(

Mr_Toad

Lum wrote: »

Well I did suggest that if space was an issue then an AIO may be worthwhile.

As for the iMac comment, what I was getting at is that there are good reasons for buying one. OSX is a good OS and their hardware is very nice looking. What they don't offer (IMO) is value for money, but for some the price premium is worth it.

All I was really trying to say is that bringing up the iMac in a thread like this is a bit of a red herring.

A fair point.

And this thread does seem to have wandered off course. :rotfl: