Does Labour never learn?

bigheadxx

CLAPTON wrote: »

Baby boomers are mainly workers and will be for many years


The only support that most retired boomers get from the state is state pension... do tell us how much that is that we are borrowing to pay for retired baby boomers.

each baby boomer that retires frees up a job for some-else... surely you celebrate that.

in the long term then the aging population is a issue that needs managing but the oldest baby boomer is only 67 ish and is hardly a major burden on the NHS or social services

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/total_spending_2009UKbi

Central government spending on pensions up from 106bn in 2009 to 149bn by 2015. That's a huge increase, even allowing for inflation. We knew the day was coming but the Labour Party went into complete reverse logic mode rather than making any preparation for it.

The other burden is retired state employees, our obligation to them will mushroom over the next few years. Retiring boomers are not going to free up jobs for younger people. Many of the jobs will no longer exist. The bb generation created a sprawling state sector and industries to create jobs for itself, always borrowing the money.

CLAPTON

bigheadxx wrote: »

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/total_spending_2009UKbi

Central government spending on pensions up from 106bn in 2009 to 149bn by 2015. That's a huge increase, even allowing for inflation. We knew the day was coming but the Labour Party went into complete reverse logic mode rather than making any preparation for it.

The other burden is retired state employees, our obligation to them will mushroom over the next few years. Retiring boomers are not going to free up jobs for younger people. Many of the jobs will no longer exist. The bb generation created a sprawling state sector and industries to create jobs for itself, always borrowing the money.

The boomer generation have never formed a majority of the electorate and they do not now.

Quite absurd to say that retiring people don't free up jobs. Not only do they free up their own actual job but they cease competing for other new jobs: although I do believe retirement will need to be postponed as our longevity increases.

But it's fair to say the the boomer generation as well as other aged groups, have produced amazing improvement in the UK (and the world) including massive advances in medicine, in science and engineering and entertainment, in education, in opportunities to travel etc all giving the UK a fantastic standard of living for ordinary people that was unthinkable in 1945.

Rejoice in your good fortune and enjoy this (maybe ) unique period of wealth and health and opportunity for you are your children.

enjoy the falling snow

PaulF81

It would have happened whoever was around. They benefitted from the conditions of the time, it had very little to do with the effort put in and far more to do with the economic dominance of the west at the time.

Now they expect early retirement and healthcare to see them to 90, whilst those who are expected to pay for it will see nothing of the sort.

CLAPTON

PaulF81 wrote: »

It would have happened whoever was around. They benefitted from the conditions of the time, it had very little to do with the effort put in and far more to do with the economic dominance of the west at the time.

Now they expect early retirement and healthcare to see them to 90, whilst those who are expected to pay for it will see nothing of the sort.

good you clarified that

anything positive that happened was inevitable and nothing to do with boomers

anything negative that happened had nothing to do with circumstance but was entirely their (probably malicious) fault.

a very balanced view

and anyway I'm sure that the younger generation, as well as currently enjoying a massively better standard of living than the boomers did at a comparable age, will in fact have better healthcare in their old age.

bigheadxx

CLAPTON wrote: »

The boomer generation have never formed a majority of the electorate and they do not now.

Quite absurd to say that retiring people don't free up jobs. Not only do they free up their own actual job but they cease competing for other new jobs: although I do believe retirement will need to be postponed as our longevity increases.

But it's fair to say the the boomer generation as well as other aged groups, have produced amazing improvement in the UK (and the world) including massive advances in medicine, in science and engineering and entertainment, in education, in opportunities to travel etc all giving the UK a fantastic standard of living for ordinary people that was unthinkable in 1945.

Rejoice in your good fortune and enjoy this (maybe ) unique period of wealth and health and opportunity for you are your children.

enjoy the falling snow

The boomer generation can determine the outcome of a general election. Every cabinet since Tony Blair has been dominated by baby boomers. It's a bb agenda. Dumbing down of politics, younger generation therefore less likely to vote so sustaining the bb agenda. That agenda will see each bb on average receive 120% back for every pound paid into the system. Who's going to pay for that? No the bb retiring at 60/65, it will be generation X, slogging it out until they are seventy five probably to die before their parents.

Relying on inflation and growth to manage our national debt is the root cause of our problems and a decade of excess and further borrowing has made it worse. Ed Balls talks of a lost decade, what about a lost generation who will probably never see the prosperity of their parents.

Progress brought us advances in medicine and foreign travel the same as it did 100, 200 and 300 years ago otherwise we would all still be living in caves. What about the environmental legacy of boomers, the damage to the planet and the squandering of resources?

That fantastic standard of living has not been paid for. Economic growth has enabled ever higher levels of debt to be sustained, we hardly ever pay it back, we just inflate it away. The easy growth road is almost at an end. The only thing in the UKs favour is that its demographics are not as bad as everybody else. Immigration and population growth will see us through but it won't match the growth of the past.

PaulF81

CLAPTON wrote: »

good you claified that

anything positive that happened was inevitable and nothing to do with boomers

anything negative that happened had nothing to do with circumstance but was entirely their (probably malicious) fault.

a very balanced view

and anyway I'm sure that the younger generation, as well as currently enjoying a massively better standard of living than the boomers did at a comparable age, will in fact have better healthcare in their old age.

They won't because they won't be able to afford it. We as a nation will have gone long broke supporting selfish boomers by then.

BobQ

bigheadxx wrote: »

The boomer generation can determine the outcome of a general election. Every cabinet since Tony Blair has been dominated by baby boomers. It's a bb agenda. Dumbing down of politics, younger generation therefore less likely to vote so sustaining the bb agenda.

Every cabinet in history has probably been dominated by an older generation. The fact that the present one cannot bother to vote when half have them would not have been entitled to do so 150 years ago says more about them than the bbs.

Relying on inflation and growth to manage our national debt is the root cause of our problems and a decade of excess and further borrowing has made it worse. Ed Balls talks of a lost decade, what about a lost generation who will probably never see the prosperity of their parents.

I find this a rather ironic comment "inflation and growth" is fundamental to capitalism and a consequence of the accumulation of wealth and profit. I do believe in that system but when I was younger accumulating wealth was very low on my agenda. The younger generations are far more driven to accumulate wealth as far as I can see.

What about the environmental legacy of boomers, the damage to the planet and the squandering of resources?

A fair point but all generations complain about what previous generations have left them. The generation about to be born will no doubt think that post boomers were selfish in their obsession with car ownership with all its dilitarious consequences.

CLAPTON

bigheadxx wrote: »

The boomer generation can determine the outcome of a general election. Every cabinet since Tony Blair has been dominated by baby boomers. It's a bb agenda. Dumbing down of politics, younger generation therefore less likely to vote so sustaining the bb agenda. That agenda will see each bb on average receive 120% back for every pound paid into the system. Who's going to pay for that? No the bb retiring at 60/65, it will be generation X, slogging it out until they are seventy five probably to die before their parents.

Relying on inflation and growth to manage our national debt is the root cause of our problems and a decade of excess and further borrowing has made it worse. Ed Balls talks of a lost decade, what about a lost generation who will probably never see the prosperity of their parents.

Progress brought us advances in medicine and foreign travel the same as it did 100, 200 and 300 years ago otherwise we would all still be living in caves. What about the environmental legacy of boomers, the damage to the planet and the squandering of resources?

That fantastic standard of living has not been paid for. Economic growth has enabled ever higher levels of debt to be sustained, we hardly ever pay it back, we just inflate it away. The easy growth road is almost at an end. The only thing in the UKs favour is that its demographics are not as bad as everybody else. Immigration and population growth will see us through but it won't match the growth of the past.

If your generation X live shorter lives than the boomers it will be because they have made unwise and unhealthy choices.

To date your generation X have, overall, enjoyed a higher standard of living than boomers at comparable ages.

Whilst the current times are somewhat difficult, the future is very promising and there are plenty of reasons for optimism.

PaulF81

CLAPTON wrote: »

If your generation X live shorter lives than the boomers it will be because they have made unwise and unhealthy choices.

To date your generation X have, overall, enjoyed a higher standard of living than boomers at comparable ages.

Whilst the current times are somewhat difficult, the future is very promising and there are plenty of reasons for optimism.

How about antibiotic resistance and a longer expected working life? Not to mention rationed NHS services?

How exactly is the future promising? I don't see any growth coming any time soon nor do we have North Sea oil to bail us out like it did with the boomers, not t mention excessive house prices, 1 trillion state debt and 500% GDP total debt.

CLAPTON

PaulF81 wrote: »

How about antibiotic resistance and a longer expected working life? Not to mention rationed NHS services?

How exactly is the future promising? I don't see any growth coming any time soon nor do we have North Sea oil to bail us out like it did with the boomers, not t mention excessive house prices, 1 trillion state debt and 500% GDP total debt.

half empty/half full

you are determined to see the down side of any situation.

so beit

antibiotic resistance is a problem to be solved; maybe by vaccination, maybe by genetic engineering, maybe it won't matter as a nuclear war or collision from outter space will wipe us out.

fracking will produce a world wide glut of gas and oil causing a drastic reduction in price; only a matter of time

excess house prices can easily be solved by building more houses (pity all problems aren't that easy) and it will reduce unemplyment and hence the deficit

rationed health service? ... try engaging your brain