commuinity charge, can anyone help please?

mndk

hi
can anyone give me some advice please.
my partner received a letter a couple of months ago from the council saying they owed £400+ community charge from 1990/1991.
now we know it has been paid as weve always paid our comm charge/ council tax every year but havent kept reciepts from 16 years ago. we were told because we have no proof we havent a leg to stand on so we have to pay, but when we aked for there proof of letters and summons they said they didnt have any on record or any copies. we recieved a baliffs letter this morning.
anything we can do?
the CAB have written to the council but we feel nothing much is happening.
what should we do if the baliffs come.
any advice or ideas would be very much appreciated.

many thanks

mountainofdebt

How did you pay it?

Hopefully it will be by a traceable method such as cheque or dd.....can you look at your statements or at least get copies of the statements?

mndk

unfortunatley it was the giro type slips you got from the council paid into the post office or bank. they were kept until five to six years ago when we thought it was ok to get rid of.
thanks for the reply

mountainofdebt

Oh dear!

I think I would argue the point that as THEY haven't got any proof that you owe the debt how can they be sure that you owe the money?

Also could you not argue that as the debt is over 6 years old then it unrecoverable?

mndk

i would of thought they couldnt recover a debt from over 16 years ago but they are.
its not a debt it was paid.
we will try that route.
i am just trying to get as much info as i can cos we are refusing to pay, but we dont know what can happen.
cheers

hodgester

if they took you to court then the 6 year rule doesn't matter but to refer it to a bailiff for collection they would have had to provide evidence of a court order. I would write to the bailiff company and ask them to provide proofs of this debt to you and then you will send them the cash. If they say they don't have proof, as it is with the council then write to the council (via recorded delivery) and ask for the proofs before settling. If they confirm they don't have the proofs then tell them you will contact media/councillor/mp etc as there is no legal warrant for the bailiff to chase the debt.

Charis

Have a look at these two websites. It would appear that a debt is unrecoverable after 6 years. Whether you can prove you paid is a separate question but as the previous poster commented they can't prove you haven't.

http://www.debtquestions.co.uk/legal_yourrights.php

Statute Barred

A debt is considered Statute Barred if a creditor has not contacted a debtor for a period of 6 years and no action has been taken on the account.

Although the debt is still legally acknowledged as being owed, the creditor is not able to take any legal action against the debtor in order to recover the debt. It is considered unfair if a creditor or debt collector misleads the debtor into believing the debt is still legally recoverable. It is also considered an unfair practice if the creditor or debt collector press for payment after the debtor has stated they will not be paying the money owed. This could amount to harassment contrary to Section 40(1) of the Administration of Justice Act 1970.


http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/IHTmanual/IHTM28384.htm

IHTM28384 - Law relating to debts: statute-barred debts

If a lender allows time to pass without receiving any payment an action for recovery may become barred.

Under the Limitations Act 1980 the time limits are

* in simple contracts, 6 years
* in contracts under seal, 12 years.

If the debtor acknowledges the debt in writing or makes a part payment within the original limitation period, then the time limits start to run again from the date of acknowledgment or the date of payment.

mndk

thanks people
i will mull over these suguestions
cheers again

hodgester

Charis wrote: »

[/b]Although the debt is still legally acknowledged as being owed, the creditor is not able to take any legal action against the debtor in order to recover the debt.[/b] .

My only concern with this is the possibility that they allege they have taken the debt to court previously, making the 6 year ruling inconsequential. As stated by Charis & I though, they can't evidence the action.

seaweasel

It's bad enough that they're pursuing what is a fairly small amount of debt considering the timescale, but what's worse is that it's the Poll Tax! Out of interest, which party controls your council (if any)?

From what other posters have said it seems that the law is on your side, good luck!

CIS

This is the offical policy from one council site I checked

Re: Poll Tax Collection
Chief Executive's Department
on the 13-Apr-07 at 16:04:01
The Limitations Act 1980 will not apply to Community Charge (Poll Tax) arrears as all these debts are secured by summary warrant. As such, the 'six year rule' quoted will not apply to these debts. Community Charge is treated as a Tax and therefore subject to certain exemptions for recovery procedures.

Community Charge debts are not statute barred. You should not ignore any demand for payment received in respect of Community Charge or any other Council service. The sums received enable the Council to fund vital services such as education, social care and policing. The Council can also be contacted on Freephone 0800337703 to discuss any arrears.

I may be wrong, but I believe that this is however dependent on a liability order being gained within 6 years of the demand for payment being issued. Once aliability order is gained then the debt stays recoverable as long as the council want.