Student rental problems

VanyaHargreeves

pmlindyloo wrote: »

Pay the £50 for the pest control officer to come and deal with the vermin and send the bill to the LA - probably won't pay but worth a try.

We've gone through the contract with a fine-toothed comb and I don't remember exactly but it said that anything we bill them with will not be paid. They also keep arguing that it's our problem because apparently they've had "no prior reports of a vermin problem", even though we told them on the first day that we moved in that we found rat poison under the kitchen cupboards - my housemate's cupboard didn't have a back to it, and a potato rolled down underneath it, so her dad took off the bottom of the cupboard to retrieve it, and there was a shocking amount of rat poison laid down underneath it!

And we considered withholding rent but we found out that we could get into big trouble for doing that, so we decided against it.

BigAunty

VanyaHargreeves wrote: »

We've gone through the contract with a fine-toothed comb and I don't remember exactly but it said that anything we bill them with will not be paid. They also keep arguing that it's our problem ..

A contract can say what it likes but clauses can be entirely unenforceable if they don't correspond to housing law.

And the agent can say what it likes about not being responsible for pest control costs and ultimately, perhaps a court will decide on their obligations or not.

The Shelter website says that there is a legal process whose steps require to be followed closely that permits tenants to withold rent for repair costs they have paid for themselves if the landlord refuses to attend to them and notice has been served about this.

Is the £50 a call out fee or does it also cover the treatment costs, too? I know your landlord sounds negligent and your agency ineffective but this is something that you may be able to sort out for a tenner a head upfront or nowt if you follow the Shelter process to legimately withold the rent for its expense.

BigAunty

RAS wrote: »

26. What happens if I don't comply with the conditions of the HMO licence?

You run the risk of prosecution and a possible fine of up to £5,000.

So have you rung the HMO licencing people and explained your situation?

LL might be in for a shock.

£20,000 fine according to other articles I've read.

In Scotland where I live (which has different laws) the councils found that the HMO legislation wasn't an effective deterrent as the fines were so low compared with repairs costs. When they introduced the Landlord Registration system (sorry OP, this only operates here) they introduced a penalty whereby the tenants for non-compliant landlords were instructed not to pay any rent. So they hit them in the pockets a lot more with the newer legislation.

RAS

BigAunty wrote: »

£20,000 fine according to other articles I've read.

Think it might be another of those things that went in the localism bill? Having said that I nicked the quote from the Hove link above, so they are out of date if it has increased.

EDIT _ OP, please ring and speak to the HMO licencing officer.

BigAunty

VanyaHargreeves wrote: »

When I spoke to Environmental Health, they told me that they would come to look at the property if I believed that there was an issue with rising damp or penetrating damp (forgot to mention that). They came and looked at the mould and ruled that it was caused neither by rising damp or penetrating damp, but by condensation. They then said that they would take no further action because of this.


....

Did you actually get a written report?

Did they undertake their inspection prior to the leaking pipe under the sink and the roof fault (if this led to water ingress)?

If so, insist they come back or go through the appeals process if you do not accept their findings that it is tenant behaviour that is causing the mould.

Also, according to their own publication, they should assess the property for pest problems, albeit they did and said you ought to use their services to eradicate them.

"Problems with
hygiene, pests and storage of rubbish can be a threat to health because

insects, rats and mice are known to spread disease and lead to cross-contamination (hazard 15).

Dwellings should be maintained in a hygienic condition with no cracks, holes or voids that would

allow entry or shelter of pests."


Perhaps you can challenge them on this? Perhaps you can ask your MP to challenge them on your behalf if you do not feel they carried out the assessment as it should have been and you do not accept their findings.

http://www.brighton-hove.gov.uk/downloads/bhcc/PSH0002-Brighton_HHSRS_leaflet_A4.pdf

I can see on their mould advice leaflet that if they don't see a tidemark from water ingress, they put it down to condensation, perhaps that's a bit simplistic, I don't know.

I do know that when my partner and I lived in our own properties for years, we never experienced mould but that both sets of tenants later caused it,with one set blocking up ventilation and not reporting a broken extractor fan. When we moved back in to our two properties to do up and sell, we never then experienced mould ...

http://www.brighton-hove.gov.uk/downloads/bhcc/PSH0003-Damp_mould_Condensation-0909.pdf

VanyaHargreeves

BigAunty wrote: »

Is the £50 a call out fee or does it also cover the treatment costs, too? I know your landlord sounds negligent and your agency ineffective but this is something that you may be able to sort out for a tenner a head upfront or nowt if you follow the Shelter process to legimately withold the rent for its expense.

It's £50 including treatment. I want to get it sorted but my housemates are not willing to pay to get it done, plus pest control will use rat poison and one of my housemates refuses to let that happen. She thinks it's perfectly fine to keep feeding the mice and if she had her own way she would make friends with them all. However she has said that if the agency arrange for someone to put down rat poison she will not argue with it. We've spent a long time trying to persuade her but she's very against it.

Almost considering bribing the agency to arrange it!

VanyaHargreeves

BigAunty wrote: »

Did you actually get a written report?

Did they undertake their inspection prior to the leaking pipe under the sink and the roof fault (if this led to water ingress)?

If so, insist they come back or go through the appeals process if you do not accept their findings that it is tenant behaviour that is causing the mould.

Also, according to their own publication, they should assess the property for pest problems, albeit they did and said you ought to use their services to eradicate them.

"Problems with
hygiene, pests and storage of rubbish can be a threat to health because

insects, rats and mice are known to spread disease and lead to cross-contamination (hazard 15).

Dwellings should be maintained in a hygienic condition with no cracks, holes or voids that would

allow entry or shelter of pests."


Perhaps you can challenge them on this? Perhaps you can ask your MP to challenge them on your behalf if you do not feel they carried out the assessment as it should have been and you do not accept their findings.

http://www.brighton-hove.gov.uk/downloads/bhcc/PSH0002-Brighton_HHSRS_leaflet_A4.pdf

I can see on their mould advice leaflet that if they don't see a tidemark from water ingress, they put it down to condensation, perhaps that's a bit simplistic, I don't know.

I do know that when my partner and I lived in our own properties for years, we never experienced mould but that both sets of tenants later caused it,with one set blocking up ventilation and not reporting a broken extractor fan. When we moved back in to our two properties to do up and sell, we never then experienced mould ...

http://www.brighton-hove.gov.uk/downloads/bhcc/PSH0003-Damp_mould_Condensation-0909.pdf

We did not get a written report, and yes they inspected the house about a month and a half ago, and were aware of the leaky pipe and the roof fault. Upon speaking to the agency further, we've been informed that the roof fault has now been repaired as they organised people to come and fix it whilst we were all away during half term.


Thank you, I wasn't aware that environmental health was involved with pest control, when I called up I was informed that they were two completely different departments and as such are unable to help with the mouse problem. I will call up again tomorrow to ask about it. They don't seem to be particularly patient with students though!

BigAunty

VanyaHargreeves wrote: »

...


Thank you, I wasn't aware that environmental health was involved with pest control, when I called up I was informed that they were two completely different departments and as such are unable to help with the mouse problem. I will call up again tomorrow to ask about it. They don't seem to be particularly patient with students though!

I'm not saying that they are directly involved with pest control, just that it should be on their radar as a hazard - it could well be the case that they discharged their responsibility with this left hand telling you that the right hand will deal with it if you raise it but if they didn't even look for cracks, holes and voids, it seems quite cursory. I don't even know that there is an obligation for them to produce anything in writing but verbal findings does seem a bit lazy.

It's just that if you think their assessment is weak or flawed, if you disbelieve condensation as the primary cause, then at least you know now that you could appeal it, demand another assessment or escalate your disatisfaction to your MP. As well as the EHO hazard assessment appeal process, the council should have its own general complaints process and then there's the council ombudsman, too.

Hope that's clearer. I happen to think your main attack should be the HMO flaws and going through the formal repairs notification/rent witholding process - they got Al Capone on tax evasion, after all.

If tenant behaviour did result in the mould and pest problem (" a crumb is a meal to a mouse!") then this is only the start of your problems as you might not see a penny of your deposits and might even find the landlord chases you via the courts for extra costs. Were your deposits placed in a deposit scheme? Do you have proof of this?

I know that it's probably the first time you've all lived away from home but I'm not impressed that so far into your tenancy, and with so many of you allegedly having research and communication skills, you are still in a mouldy, damp, pest ridden property with broken furniture. I know that you've contacted various bodies and they've not been particularly effective on your behalf but there does seem to be a lot of dawdling. I take it that your flatmates have dumped this issue onto you?

PS - I know that Brighton council has farcicly bad services. My partner rented out their private property for 3 years on their private sector leasing scheme which encourages landlords to consider letting the council manage their properties. The property was returned in a totally trashed fashion, many months after the tenants should have left (they refused to leave until the council gave them a nice council place and the housing officers admitted that they couldn't evict the tenant because of the Human Rights Act). We thought they had opened up an anti social case against the tenant because of the frequent police visits and complaints by neighbours about their behaviour, only to find out belatedly that they dismissed every report as unsubstantiated hearsay.

CharlieRabbit01

Probably not what you want to hear but when i lived in a student house in Brighton we had very similar problems, our agency was awful, we ended up just moving out at the end of the tenancy.

Our big problem was trying to get our deposit back so watch out for that.

BigAunty

CharlieRabbit01 wrote: »

Probably not what you want to hear but when i lived in a student house in Brighton we had very similar problems, our agency was awful, we ended up just moving out at the end of the tenancy.

Our big problem was trying to get our deposit back so watch out for that.

Probably also not want you want to hear, but as I mentioned earlier, as an admin assistant in a Uni accommodation office, despite frequent reports of rogue landlords by students we also used to get inundated with complaints by landlords about student rent arrears, damage and anti social behaviour...