Is this fraud & should I report it?

custardy

missapril75 wrote: »

The key to the funding being entitlement to free school meals - a benefit which is due as a result of benefits. :rotfl:

Seriously....it is benefit related far more than all those other issues in DT.

its not a benefit for the school
its funding. they are applying for benefits

[Deleted User]

Naf wrote: »

The benefit goes to the school as funding for a child's meals - making a claim for a child who is not actually having those meals is fraud either on the part of the school or parent(s) or both...
It's not funding; the school collects money from parents for school meals, this is a state benefit for low income families.

no sorry you are wrong,as a former school governor i can assure you of that
some parts of school funding is dependant on the % of children who are elligible for free school meals,thats all simple as that
they will not get any extra money for providing food they dont provide,but if they have a high % of pupils who could get free meals it will lead to additional funding elsewhere that will benefit ALL the pupils
THERE IS NO FRAUD INVOLVED AT ALL

missapril75

custardy wrote: »

its not a benefit for the school

Did I say it was A Benefit? I think not. It involves benefits for the parents and the funding is dependent upon that.

Therefore it is benefit related and this is the benefits part of the forum.

I am simply saying to those that think this should be in the DT forum that I feel it is more appropriate here, given it is related to benefits, than it is in a part of the forum that includes such topics as loans, credit cards, mortgages, house buying, investments, insurance, charities,phones, relationships, health, holidays, motoring, IT, DIY, betting, consumer rights, celebrations, armed forces and bargain hunting.

Feel free to have a different opinion but please don't attribute to me things I have not said.

It is OF benefit to the school...is that better?

ILW

No fraud, just bear in mind that generally "high proportion eligible for free meals = sink school". When the figures come out, the "better" parents tend to take their children elsewhere and things just go downhill.

Naf

Own_My_Own wrote: »

OP you do realise the funding is used for all the children in the school.

I get a sneaky feeling you think that the extra money get spent only on the kids with parents who don't work.

Did you think your children would miss out ?

You work but it is their kids get extra funding at school ?

Did that annoy you ?

Nothing to do with that; we probably receive more benefits than most - including the free school meals.

custardy wrote: »

but its not really a benefit question
it relates more to school funding

Sort of; I now understand about the funding per eligible child; but the school are specifically asking to claim the lunch money, even if the child has no school lunch. It is a different question to ask parents to let them know if they would be eligible because of other funding.

clearingout wrote: »

This isn't the cause. There is a payment to schools called the 'pupil premium'. It is paid per head that is eligible for free school meals. The school isn't aware of who is eligible if they don't claim - and plenty don't. I was eligible for a couple of years but my children took packed lunches during this time because that is what they preferred, for example.

Schools send out letters such as this because they will get the pupil premium based on this eligibility There does not need to be a claim for free school meals to get it.

You will find that most schools will publish somewhere on their website how much they received in 'pupil premium' and what they spent it on.

Thank you for this; I now understand why they want to know who is eligible; but it still doesn't explain why their phrasing specifically asks parents to claim the meal allowance, even if they don't use it.

Naf

custardy wrote: »

its not a benefit for the school
its funding. they are applying for benefits

No, the eligibility for free meals is a state benefit for the parent(s) - and it is this that I feel is fraudulent, not the school funding which is partly dependent on the % who are eligible for free meals.
The school have specifically asked parents to "apply for this entitlement, even if you do not want your child to receive free school meals". If the parent knows their child is not having school meals, then the claim is fraudulent.

woodbine wrote: »

no sorry you are wrong,as a former school governor i can assure you of that
some parts of school funding is dependant on the % of children who are elligible for free school meals,thats all simple as that
they will not get any extra money for providing food they dont provide,but if they have a high % of pupils who could get free meals it will lead to additional funding elsewhere that will benefit ALL the pupils
THERE IS NO FRAUD INVOLVED AT ALL

So why have they asked parents to apply for the entitlement, not just let the school know they are eligible? The parts dependent on the % I'm fine with - not the school encouraging parents to claim things they are not entitled to. They are only entitled to free school meals; not entitled to a payment (even though this payment goes direct to the school, it is still for the family) for meals that they never actually have.

[Deleted User]

ILW wrote: »

No fraud, just bear in mind that generally "high proportion eligible for free meals = sink school". When the figures come out, the "better" parents tend to take their children elsewhere and things just go downhill.

not always so the school my kids went to had around 32% on free school meals it was then and remains now the best school in the area and always over subscribed

Blackpool_Saver

isn't it odd how a school can claim extra money on the basis of the number of free meals children and then use it elsewhere, BUT if a parent were to do something similar it would be fraudulent

custardy

Naf wrote: »

No, the eligibility for free meals is a state benefit for the parent(s) - and it is this that I feel is fraudulent, not the school funding which is partly dependent on the % who are eligible for free meals.
The school have specifically asked parents to "apply for this entitlement, even if you do not want your child to receive free school meals". If the parent knows their child is not having school meals, then the claim is fraudulent.

so how would you budget for it?
a potential 25% attendance. only 17% are using it at that point.
so you budget for 17% only?
where do you find the other 8% from if their circumstances/decisions change and they start taking the meals?

clearingout

Naf wrote: »

No, the eligibility for free meals is a state benefit for the parent(s) - and it is this that I feel is fraudulent, not the school funding which is partly dependent on the % who are eligible for free meals.
The school have specifically asked parents to "apply for this entitlement, even if you do not want your child to receive free school meals". If the parent knows their child is not having school meals, then the claim is fraudulent.

So why have they asked parents to apply for the entitlement, not just let the school know they are eligible? The parts dependent on the % I'm fine with - not the school encouraging parents to claim things they are not entitled to. They are only entitled to free school meals; not entitled to a payment (even though this payment goes direct to the school, it is still for the family) for meals that they never actually have.

in our case, I had to let the local authority know that I was eligible for free school meals and send them evidence of this (Income Support letter), not the school. It is the local authority in charge of dishing out funding so presumably, it is up to them to collect the necessary paperwork - indeed, free school meals are sorted through the local authority as well. The local authority will then make their claim to central government, I assume, and pass the money on to the schools. Just bureaucracy. There is nothing sinister or remotely fradulent in what you are describing.