Business Plan: Bar/Pub

Carlx_2

I am in the process of writing a business plan and would like to ask anybody who owns or operates a bar in England if they could give me a rough estimate of the rates i would likely need to pay on the following information:

First, a little information about the surrounding area.

I have found a premise on a high street in a small town, i know the 3 closest pub/bars gross turnover as these were leaked to me by mistake.

The largest pub is opposite and has a weekly turnover of £25,000 - £36,000 per week.
Medium pub 800m away has a gross turnover of £10,000 - £12,000 per week.
Smallest, awful bar, that is 50m away, has a turnover of £8,000 - £9,000 per week.

The premise i want to use is bigger than the medium sized pub and in a better central high street location directly opposite the largest pub in the town.

The ground floor space of the premise i want is around 1600ft2. I estimate that my weekly turnover will be in the region of £10,000.

Please advise on rough costs for the following:

Business rates:
Insurance:
Gas:
Water:
Electricity:
Machine rental:
Phone:
Licenses:
Sky TV:

I have a more exhaustive list but this is some of the things i am not so sure on, if you can think of something i may well have over looked, then please advise on that too, it is greatly appreciated.

floopnoodle

Carlx wrote: »

I have found a premise on a high street in a small town, i know the 3 closest pub/bars gross turnover as these were leaked to me by mistake.

Leaked by who?

Carlx_2

floopnoodle wrote: »

Leaked by who?

The brewery who deals with all 3 of the pubs, i poked and he eventually opened up and shared all he knew.

somethingcorporate

Is there no chance you can go back and ask for a set of accounts, these would be your best bet for some reasonable figures for your location.

floopnoodle

Carlx wrote: »

The brewery who deals with all 3 of the pubs, i poked and he eventually opened up and shared all he knew.

I'd take everything 'the man trying to get you to sign the lease' says with a pinch of salt. I'm not saying it isn't true, but it's not likely to be

Carlx_2

The brewery has accounts for turnover because they share the bars on the pubs, in regards to expenses, all the brewery knows is their own wet stock costs, they have no right at the other expenses.

No chance of seeing their books and i dont think a pub in land would share that much! However when i go to visit my family i will ask in a few of the pubs i used to visit for more informtion, i just thought it would be handy to get as many peices of information as possible and ask on the forum first.

floopnoodle

Carlx wrote: »

The brewery has accounts for turnover because they share the bars on the pubs, in regards to expenses, all the brewery knows is their own wet stock costs, they have no right at the other expenses.

No chance of seeing their books and i dont think a pub in land would share that much! However when i go to visit my family i will ask in a few of the pubs i used to visit for more informtion, i just thought it would be handy to get as many peices of information as possible and ask on the forum first.

What about the accounts for the bar you are interested in?

I understand the Brewery has access to the information, what I am saying is that if the figures are bad then they wouldn't tell you, or they may increase the figures to make it sound a better proposition to you.

Carlx_2

floopnoodle wrote: »

What about the accounts for the bar you are interested in?

I understand the Brewery has access to the information, what I am saying is that if the figures are bad then they wouldn't tell you, or they may increase the figures to make it sound a better proposition to you.

In regards to the bar i want, it is an old retail building, it has had all planning accepted to turn it into a bar with a night club upstairs - that was back in 2007 when a previous person started but due to a death in the family pulled out, nobody has taken it on since then.

I understand that the brewery could inflate turnovers to make it seem better than it really is, but they sat down with me to do really brief calculations and around £6000 turnover would create a profit - obviously i want to sit down and do some calculations myself with more information from a wide variety of sources.

Suarez

Why not order a set of accounts from one of the other pubs? You can also find out their turnover on duedil.

Edit : assuming they are a registered company.

paddyrg

Can you look at other breweries, or find a way to not be a tied house? When breweries are business partners/lending the money and the licensee is tied, the licensee might find there are better wholesale deals open to them from the rest of the market but they're tied into a lower GP. Basically, if Booker do a crate of beer X for £10 on promotion, if you're tied, you may still have to pay £20 for the same crate (or a similar beer) from your brewery.

podperson

You should be able to research estimates on most of those - speak to the council on rates, get quotes on utilties and insurance, look into what licences you need and how much. A lot is going to depend on your council/area/size etc - it's no good someone at the other end of the country in a pub half the size telling you what they pay.