Deposit not protected, returned in full but with bill...

TeamLowe

Hello knowledgable ladies and gents,
On Friday i handed back the keys to my rented house. Whilst there, i was told that the house would need a deep clean and a new carpet in the lounge as it had a few marks and our cat (pets not mentioned in the contract) and pulled at it, not hugely so but a few threads lifted up, i think the term is pilling?

I wasn't happy with the idea of a brand new carpet or the deep clean, as the check in report said the carpet was marked but felt quite intimated so just said fine and thought I'll argue the price later through the deposit protection scheme.

when we moved in we was given the T&Cs for the Deposit Protection Scheme but i realised we'd never received a tenancy code. so i tried all three websites and nothing. emailed the agent to ask for the tenancy code and received the following email....

Further to your move out of the above property, as discussed your deposit of £530 was been credited to your nominated account on Friday 8th February. In line with your tenancy responsibilities and agreement, please see attached bill of outstanding works for your attention. If you believe you are able to source this work cheaper please advise us when you would require access bearing in mind we have a time limit of 14 days to complete these works.
Letting Agent.

The bill i received is 360 for the carpet and 120 for the deep clean - conveniently less than the deposit amount, which sure enough is in my account.

so ladies and gents, what would you do? my gut instinct is to write and say i'm not happy with the bill amount, ask for a break down, argue for a reduction for fair wear and tear. then once that's settled sue them/landlord for compensation for the deposit not being protected.

HappyMJ

LOL...if you don't agree with the deductions then don't pay. It's now a civil claim if they want the money they have to take you to court. I find that unlikely.

Carpet..£360? Where did they go? How many square metres? How old was the original carpet? They don't get all the money for new for old. If the carpet was 7 years or older then it's unlikely they'll get much at all. They might get 30% of the cost of new carpet if 7 years old assuming the life of the carpet was estimated at 10 years.

The tenancy deposit service knows this and that's why they probably just agreed for it to be refunded in full.

martinsurrey

well your within your rights to sue for compensation, but since

a) the fault was a minor one (the deposit was protected)
b) they didn’t try and make deductions - they repaid in full
c) have not acted in a menacing way

the court will not be overly impressed with you and since its in their power to decide how much compensation to pay, and who pays costs, it might not be a good idea (and its not a small claims court claim, it’s a full on court case).

They are also well within their rights to ask for damage costs.

And they can claim in the small claim court, which is far easier and cheaper.

I suggest you negotiate a full and final settlement of the whole thing and walk away.

pmlindyloo

TeamLowe wrote: »

Hello knowledgable ladies and gents,
On Friday i handed back the keys to my rented house. Whilst there, i was told that the house would need a deep clean and a new carpet in the lounge as it had a few marks and our cat (pets not mentioned in the contract) and pulled at it, not hugely so but a few threads lifted up, i think the term is pilling?

I wasn't happy with the idea of a brand new carpet or the deep clean, as the check in report said the carpet was marked but felt quite intimated so just said fine and thought I'll argue the price later through the deposit protection scheme.

when we moved in we was given the T&Cs for the Deposit Protection Scheme but i realised we'd never received a tenancy code. so i tried all three websites and nothing. emailed the agent to ask for the tenancy code and received the following email....

Further to your move out of the above property, as discussed your deposit of £530 was been credited to your nominated account on Friday 8th February. In line with your tenancy responsibilities and agreement, please see attached bill of outstanding works for your attention. If you believe you are able to source this work cheaper please advise us when you would require access bearing in mind we have a time limit of 14 days to complete these works.
Letting Agent.

The bill i received is 360 for the carpet and 120 for the deep clean - conveniently less than the deposit amount, which sure enough is in my account.

so ladies and gents, what would you do? my gut instinct is to write and say i'm not happy with the bill amount, ask for a break down, argue for a reduction for fair wear and tear. then once that's settled sue them/landlord for compensation for the deposit not being protected.

So you have your deposit back and now you have been sent a bill for the deep clean and carpet.

It seems because you agreed to the deductions they have not gone through the deposit protection scheme dispute service because there was no dispute. However, I am a bit confused about this because you say you received the information but when you checked it wasn't registered? When did you check? After the deposit was received by you? Please confirm the time line.

You need to ask for a breakdown of the amount for the carpet. Does it say how old it was in the inventory and what marks were detailed. If you accept that you did do some damage (or at least the cat did!) then you need to negotiate the amount you are paying. They cannot ask for 'betterment' ie ask for you to pay for a new carpet. They need to take into account fair wear and tear and the state of the carpet when you started your tenancy.

As regards the deep clean - do you think this is reasonable? Have you tried to get quotes yourself?

My own opinion is that they are being quite reasonable asking you if you can source this work cheaper. You just need to check the details about the carpet.

spacey2012

Reply :
Thank you for you return of the unprotected deposit.
We reserve our legal rights in respect of action from not protecting our deposit.
As we understand the court will award 3x the deposit amount if we bring action.
£530 x 3 = £1590
On proof and production of a signed by both parties inventory mentioning the carpet and cleaning we are prepared to accept £1100 minus the £530 returned as damages for failure to protect our deposit.
We are prepared to offer a limited acceptance agreement not to pursue the 3x deposit claim via the courts in return for withdrawal of the claims for speculative amounts for carpet and cleaning you have submitted .
I shall leave the offer open for 14 days, after which if no acceptance is made or agreed I shall bring court action for failure to protect our deposit.
Therefore this letter also serves as a Letter before action.
I look forward to you acceptance/ decline of my offer to mitigate your losses.

TeamLowe

martinsurrey wrote: »

well your within your rights to sue for compensation, but since

a) the fault was a minor one (the deposit was protected)
b) they didn’t try and make deductions - they repaid in full
c) have not acted in a menacing way

the court will not be overly impressed with you and since its in their power to decide how much compensation to pay, and who pays costs, it might not be a good idea (and its not a small claims court claim, it’s a full on court case).

They are also well within their rights to ask for damage costs.

And they can claim in the small claim court, which is far easier and cheaper.

I suggest you negotiate a full and final settlement of the whole thing and walk away.

well the woman was downright horrid to me at check out and when i argued the toss and said there were marks on the carpet when we moved in she got her colleague who checked us in to come round and also berate me about it.

but yeah, i just want to cause them issues for being mean to me, which is not a very mature approach i admit

TeamLowe

pmlindyloo wrote: »

So you have your deposit back and now you have been sent a bill for the deep clean and carpet.

It seems because you agreed to the deductions they have not gone through the deposit protection scheme dispute service because there was no dispute. However, I am a bit confused about this because you say you received the information but when you checked it wasn't registered? When did you check? After the deposit was received by you? Please confirm the time line.

You need to ask for a breakdown of the amount for the carpet. Does it say how old it was in the inventory and what marks were detailed. If you accept that you did do some damage (or at least the cat did!) then you need to negotiate the amount you are paying. They cannot ask for 'betterment' ie ask for you to pay for a new carpet. They need to take into account fair wear and tear and the state of the carpet when you started your tenancy.

As regards the deep clean - do you think this is reasonable? Have you tried to get quotes yourself?

My own opinion is that they are being quite reasonable asking you if you can source this work cheaper. You just need to check the details about the carpet.

Timeline, and apologies for confusion -
9 September 2010 - sign 12 month contract and receive copy of the terms and conditions for the Deposit Protection Scheme.
During check-in it's noted that there is 'a few marks' on the carpet in the living room and on the wall of the stairway as well as other minor faults.

8 February 2013 - agreed check out date, keys handed back.

That night as i was going through my papers for the house to look at the check in report, i noticed that i didn't have a tenancy code for the DPS. checked the websites for all three schemes, nothing there. emailed the letting agent to ask for tenancy code.

11 February 2013- got the email in the OP and checked my bank account, sure enough, the full amount of my deposit was put in on Friday 8 February 2013.

I really don't think it was in a protection scheme- I've checked out of houses twice before and it's been at least a week before i've even had a letter to say what i'm getting back let alone the actual money being in my account the exact same day.
Plus the T&Cs for the DPS they did give said i would have to go online to agree to the amount being recieved by me and if i had agreed to deductions, then i'd agree to them on there as well, wouldn't i?

The house was built in 2007 and i'd place a fairly good wager that the carpet was the one put in by the builders as it's in all the other houses advertised on that estate, although i'm no good with sizes but maybe 11x11? it's a funny shape as its a living room/kitchen but the kitchen has a vinyl flooring.

I object to the deep clean as a) it's vague b) i left that house cleaner than when i moved in and c) there definitely wasn't a deep clean before i moved in, unless 'deep clean' avoids toilets, ovens and showers and doesn't get rid of marks on carpets

TeamLowe

spacey2012 wrote: »

Reply :
Thank you for you return of the unprotected deposit.
We reserve our legal rights in respect of action from not protecting our deposit.
As we understand the court will award 3x the deposit amount if we bring action.
£530 x 3 = £1590
On proof and production of a signed by both parties inventory mentioning the carpet and cleaning we are prepared to accept £1100 minus the £530 returned as damages for failure to protect our deposit.
We are prepared to offer a limited acceptance agreement not to pursue the 3x deposit claim via the courts in return for withdrawal of the claims for speculative amounts for carpet and cleaning you have submitted .
I shall leave the offer open for 14 days, after which if no acceptance is made or agreed I shall bring court action for failure to protect our deposit.
Therefore this letter also serves as a Letter before action.
I look forward to you acceptance/ decline of my offer to mitigate your losses.

I like it :cool:

also, it was made clear to me by the intimidating woman who conducted the 'check out' that i would not be present during the report, so i haven't signed anything to say i accept the deductions, although obviously she had her colleague there as well, although all i said was 'i'll pay what i have to' no actual amounts were discussed.

DRP

TeamLowe wrote: »

Timeline, and apologies for confusion -
9 September 2010 - sign 12 month contract and receive copy of the terms and conditions for the Deposit Protection Scheme.
During check-in it's noted that there is 'a few marks' on the carpet in the living room and on the wall of the stairway as well as other minor faults.

8 February 2013 - agreed check out date, keys handed back.

That night as i was going through my papers for the house to look at the check in report, i noticed that i didn't have a tenancy code for the DPS. checked the websites for all three schemes, nothing there. emailed the letting agent to ask for tenancy code.

11 February 2013- got the email in the OP and checked my bank account, sure enough, the full amount of my deposit was put in on Friday 8 February 2013.

I really don't think it was in a protection scheme- I've checked out of houses twice before and it's been at least a week before i've even had a letter to say what i'm getting back let alone the actual money being in my account the exact same day.
Plus the T&Cs for the DPS they did give said i would have to go online to agree to the amount being recieved by me and if i had agreed to deductions, then i'd agree to them on there as well, wouldn't i?

The house was built in 2007 and i'd place a fairly good wager that the carpet was the one put in by the builders as it's in all the other houses advertised on that estate, although i'm no good with sizes but maybe 11x11? it's a funny shape as its a living room/kitchen but the kitchen has a vinyl flooring.

I object to the deep clean as a) it's vague b) i left that house cleaner than when i moved in and c) there definitely wasn't a deep clean before i moved in, unless 'deep clean' avoids toilets, ovens and showers and doesn't get rid of marks on carpets

Is the damage caused by your cat enough to require a replacement carpet? given that the carpet was *already* damaged, it sounds like they're trying it on in order to get a brand new carpet at your expense ... or more likely, they won't even bother replacing it and pocket your cash.

Do they have your agreement with the deep clean and carpet in writing? I suppose they could argue that by not questioning the subsequent email from them you have implicitly agreed that you are responsible?


Maybe offer them the 120 for the clean and tell them you were unable to source a 6 year old stained carpet to replace the existing one... :rotfl:

ps I prefer Spacey2012's answer tbh

TeamLowe

DRP wrote: »

Is the damage caused by your cat enough to require a replacement carpet? given that the carpet was *already* damaged, it sounds like they're trying it on in order to get a brand new carpet at your expense ... or more likely, they won't even bother replacing it and pocket your cash.

Do they have your agreement with the deep clean and carpet in writing? I suppose they could argue that by not questioning the subsequent email from them you have implicitly agreed that you are responsible?


Maybe offer them the 120 for the clean and tell them you were unable to source a 6 year old stained carpet to replace the existing one... :rotfl:

ps I prefer Spacey2012's answer tbh

it's hard to describe unless you've seen a cat do it, but it's one of those carpets where it's twists of cheap fibre and all he's done is pull those twists up slightly in a couple of places. it's not gone threadbare and it's not enough to be a tripping hazard and whilst i may be biased i'd say it's still as good a carpet as it ever was.