Help - advice needed about Court of Protection

Lleucu

I am hoping someone has some knowledge of how to help someone who does not have capacity.

A neighbour aged 60 appears to have had a catastrophic stroke - currently there are clinical investigations ongoing, he is supported by friends in the area. He appears to have very little memory and certainly lacks capacity to give agreement in financial matters. He does not have a partner.

His friends are determined to help him stay at home and are working hard to get all the support in place for him incl applying for DLA.

One key issue is about access to his money. There is no agreement in place and he certainly does not have the capacity to make an agreement - what should his friends do? Contact the Court of Protection directly or should social services do this? What are the time scales because he cannot live off everybody else indefinitely.
Does anyone have any experience of a problem like this?

Katykat

Hello, sorry about your neighbour. It is too late for him to appoint a Power of Atorney as you have to have all your faculties in order to do this. I think the only option id for someone to apply to the Court of Protection to become a deputy. https://www.gov.uk/become-deputy/overview
However, it isn't a simple procedure as you can see from the info in the link but I don't think there is much choice.

CouponWoman

Lleucu wrote: »

I am hoping someone has some knowledge of how to help someone who does not have capacity.

A neighbour aged 60 appears to have had a catastrophic stroke - currently there are clinical investigations ongoing, he is supported by friends in the area. He appears to have very little memory and certainly lacks capacity to give agreement in financial matters. He does not have a partner.

His friends are determined to help him stay at home and are working hard to get all the support in place for him incl applying for DLA.

One key issue is about access to his money. There is no agreement in place and he certainly does not have the capacity to make an agreement - what should his friends do? Contact the Court of Protection directly or should social services do this? What are the time scales because he cannot live off everybody else indefinitely.
Does anyone have any experience of a problem like this?

You can phone social services who can help in these matters. I know you say everyone wants him to remain in his home, but he might need a lot of support which social services will help with. They can sort out a claim for DLA and work out access to his money.

xx

Katykat

Leucu, as you can see from the above posts, its a minefield. I will share my experience with you. My mother made me her Power of Attorney when she was of sound mind. Unfortunately, she developed Alzeimers and was no longer able to manage her affairs. I activated the POA with the Court of Protection. They sent me a letter of acknowledgment which said that I had to keep accurate records , I could use her money for her expenses and any out of pocket expenses of my own and they had the right to ask me to produce receipts, accounts, whatever at any time. I did teverything they asked, but in 5 years they never asked for receipts. I believe that they are more rigorous with people who apply to be deputies, which has the same responsibilities as POA's. so, its not a task to be taken lightly. POA's and Deputies are allowed to take out of pocket expenses but this means things like petrol used if you are conducting business for the person. However, if the Deputy is a Solicitor, they charge for their time ( which I'm not saying is wrong) but the charges are quite high and this all comes out of the persons savings. Also, Solicitors dont do things like shopping for clothes and toiletries, so someone also has to take on this roll. Personally, I would not like a Solicitor to take charge of my money if I wasn't able to do it myself.

rogerblack

Errata wrote: »

Don't be daft. A neighbour can't rock up at a solicitors and ask them to take responsibility for another neighbours affairs!

Certainly they can.
Plop down a large wad of cash, and the solicitor will be quite happy to request to the court that they are given the requisite powers.

Richie-from-the-Boro

How to ~ Application forms and guidance ~ Stupidly astronomic costs ~ Bailii online case law dBase ~ Biased but wide ranging not technical overview

Now you know why legal understanding is preferred by most people. The Court of Protection, warts and all, is all you've got. The fact of the matter is they are widely used by many organisations for emptying bank accounts mainly by local and public authorities. Relatives even where they exist, unless they move quicker than the local and public authorities, can be completely locked out of their loved ones finances and indeed their entire life.

Its the best we have for our deeply vulnerable, often those with the most intense mental health problems - however proceed with caution - it can, and often does, lead to deprivation of liberty itself.

NOTE : Be aware that people like 'Katykat' who have real live experience of navigating the system, and have hands on experience to offer free of charge.

Lleucu

Thanks for all your advice - fascinating discussion. Still no further ahead about how he is supposed to survive pro tem. I worked for the LA for many years and cannot recall a similar situation. Could a claim be made for Income Support until Court of Protection is sorted out??

Errata

rogerblack wrote: »

Certainly they can.
Plop down a large wad of cash, and the solicitor will be quite happy to request to the court that they are given the requisite powers.

When they don't even know the person from Adam, or even that they exist? Which would be the case if a neighbour attempted to task the solicitor.

rogerblack

Errata wrote: »

When they don't even know the person from Adam, or even that they exist? Which would be the case if a neighbour attempted to task the solicitor.

I diddn't say it'd work - just that they'd be quite happy to.

Richie-from-the-Boro

Lleucu wrote: »

Thanks for all your advice - fascinating discussion. Still no further ahead about how he is supposed to survive pro tem. I worked for the LA for many years and cannot recall a similar situation. Could a claim be made for Income Support until Court of Protection is sorted out??

Lleucu, without family, and even if there was willing family, its going to be difficult. you could as Katykat said take out a deputy order. If, as non family, you are granted deputy power over property and financial affairs, and a separate additional deputyship for health and welfare covering the care and medical treatment that is one heck of a responsibility.

But you are not family, apart from social services there's little anyone can do other than offer care & support. That's why if no spouse, partner or close relative is available solicitors [Professional Deputy] and local authority are almost always seen as most appropriate. No state function will deal with you. You have no authority to speak for him, that's what POA and COP is for, and even before you could embark on that you'd have to have him declared under the MCA.

Best of luck

Richie-from-the-Boro

Errata wrote: »

When they don't even know the person from Adam, or even that they exist? Which would be the case if a neighbour attempted to task the solicitor.

- it wouldn't stand much if any chance .. .. see #10
- the tasked solicitor would know that before the get~go
- it would not however stop him taking the 'large wad of cash'
- which is what 'rogerblack' said