Disciplinary hearing advice please

toerag33

Hi

Advice would be much appreciated as to how my DD deals with this. My DD works 2 shifts in the bar/restaurant of a 5* hotel over any 2 days from 2pm-10pm since July 2012. She arrived for her shift 2 minutes late having permission from the assistant manager to be late as she was attending an interview.

It was a dreadful shift for various reasons which I can relate if it will be helpful.

The manager looked at the clock when she arrived and DD explained the reason she was 2 minutes late. Later in the evening she was told all her shifts were from 3-11 and had been changed the previous week and she was to stay till 11pm. DD pointed out she had had no break, no food or fluids and it was now almost 10pm. DD went to the office and got the rota which showed her shifts as 2-10 to the manager - unfortunately she has no copy.

DD has received a text message at 23.58:
'DD's first name, I herewith inform you that you will have a disciplinary hearing on Sunday, 27th of January at 6pm. Please come to my office. Thank you.'

Apologies for the length of this and happy to add any information that would be helpful. All advice very gratefully received.

Thank-you
toerag33

mum2one

Have they said what the discilplinary is for? I'm guessing it is because she was late.

As for shifts if they were displayed as 2-10pm those would be the shifts she would work, she has to have 7 days notice to change a shift, (they could ask in an emergency) but not like that.

I find text an odd way of notifying a disciplinary (but then i could be old fashioned).

I would have a look on line at ACAS or give them a ring and see what they suggest,

DD is entitled to have a witness at the meeting such a fellow employee,

Sorry to ask how long as DD worked for them? x

mum2one

You may need to check it out, as the law changed from when I sued my employer - but sure that it has to be a minimum of 48hrs notice for a disciplinary (do check) - so your daughter can refuse it. Any communication she has put in writing and keep a copy.

My bet is someone hs heard shes had an interview and have decided she might be going so lets help her go!

ratbagthecat

Hi there. I work in HR, only as a general assistant so not 100% sure what I say is correct, but here is my advice...

The manager has to give minimum of 24 hours notice for disciplinary. It has to be in writing stating date, time and venue for meeting to be held and has to state the reason for the disciplinary. They should also give the option for her to have someone accompany her in the meeting, such as another colleague or union rep, but its not her legal right to have someone there.

Obv I dont know her employment background so dont know if this is first time she has been in 'trouble' there or if she is aware that other members of staff have had difficulty but either way what the manager is doing is wrong and she shouldn't accept this.

My boyfriend recently went through similar. Within half hour of doing a minimal wrong they had him disciplined with final written warning for gross misconduct. Everything they did was completely ridiculous and mostly against employment law. I managed to get that down to first written warning for minor misconduct for him. But it took a lot of work and research and letter writing. However, I wouldnt let it go mainly because I knew they were in the wrong and also as this would go on any future references.

Tell her to tell her manager that by texting her what he did he has broken the ACAS disciplinary & grievance code of practice and that she will be seeking advice from her union rep (even if she hasnt got one!). See what they say then, and if need be join a union if the company doesnt have an HR dept (which most small bars dont). Also tell her to look for a new job. No one should be working in a place that doesn't follow employment law.

Good luck and sorry for really long reply!

Sambucus_Nigra

ratbagthecat wrote: »

Hi there. I work in HR, only as a general assistant so not 100% sure what I say is correct, but here is my advice...

The first rule of HR is to know that the rules change depending on length of service, and so the first question should be 'how long has she worked there?'

And once you had read that she had been there less than 2 years after April last year - none of your advice follows as they can do pretty much what they want baring pregnancy or discrimination issues, until she has been there 2 years.

Tiglath

She's been working there since July 2012 by the sounds of it, so only 6 months.

Uncertain

Indeed.

Apart from the the last two comments the standard of advice above is terrible!

OP, given that your daughter has been there for less than two years the company could dismiss her without any formalities (apart from paying notice). They don't even have to give a reason. So, any invitation to a meeting (by text or otherwise) is an improvement. There is no longer a requirement to follow a statutory procedure. It has been replaced by guidelines. Had she been there long enough to have protection against unfair dismissal then the firm would be ill advised not to follow them but even then it is not an absolute requirement.

Strictly speaking the invitation to a disciplinary meeting should tell her that she has a right to be accompanied by a colleague or trade union rep. However, given that she has only been there six months there is no useful redress on this point either.

All she can do is put her side of the story and hope they let her keep her job (assuming that is what she wants). If they don't she is entitled to a week's notice (or more if her contract requires) plus payment for all untaken holiday.

hippygran

Is the hotel in private hands OR a chain?

Important - because as the employment length is so short - her 'employment rights' don't actually exist for another 18 months.

However, a larger company will (surprisingly) often give the employee more rights than those laid down in law!

So if it is a big company, first port of call would be the employee hand book, which will give details of company policies, including their internal disciplinary procedures. If a company lays down procedures, believe me a manager will not get away without implementing them, and any decision arising from a disciplinary where the procedures have not been followed to the letter will soon be overturned on appeal.

The multinational company I worked for, gave all employees the right to a fair disciplinary hearing from day one of their employment. It made it very difficult for managers to 'get rid' of staff.

I took minutes for many appeals for regional managers, and even heard some myself.

Quite a few of them (over half) I would say, had the original decisions overturned, or a smaller penalty (even reinstatement following dismissal in more that one case) not because the employee was innocent of what was alleged, but simply because the manager simply had not followed company procedure.

Sambucus_Nigra

hippygran wrote: »

Is the hotel in private hands OR a chain?

Important - because as the employment length is so short - her 'employment rights' don't actually exist for another 18 months.

However, a larger company will (surprisingly) often give the employee more rights than those laid down in law!

So if it is a big company, first port of call would be the employee hand book, which will give details of company policies, including their internal disciplinary procedures. If a company lays down procedures, believe me a manager will not get away without implementing them, and any decision arising from a disciplinary where the procedures have not been followed to the letter will soon be overturned on appeal.

The multinational company I worked for, gave all employees the right to a fair disciplinary hearing from day one of their employment. It made it very difficult for managers to 'get rid' of staff.

I took minutes for many appeals for regional managers, and even heard some myself.

Quite a few of them (over half) I would say, had the original decisions overturned, or a smaller penalty (even reinstatement following dismissal in more that one case) not because the employee was innocent of what was alleged, but simply because the manager simply had not followed company procedure.

A chain IS a private company.

Just because this happened once to you does not mean it will happen in this instance. Posts like this are well meaning but to be honest, complete nonsense. Even in big companies, managers can dismiss without following their own procedures, because the law allows them to, as the requirement to follow own procedure was repealed.

toerag33

Thank-you for all your help. I have just answered DD's mobile to the manager and said she was sleeping. The manager wanted to know if DD had received her text message and would like DD to call back.

What is DD's next step?

Thank-you

spacey2012

toerag33 wrote: »

Thank-you for all your help. I have just answered DD's mobile to the manager and said she was sleeping. The manager wanted to know if DD had received her text message and would like DD to call back.

What is DD's next step?

Thank-you

look for a better Job and tell them to go Screw