why do some cars skid in the snow more than others?

Gloomendoom

fivetide wrote: »

I have no idea why it would be better to take it off in deep snow, the issues I personally experienced were with very slick, icy conditions.

See RichardD1970's post above.

Generally speaking, disabling the ABS is a daft idea. However, if it works for you, fair enough.

Turning off the traction control is often advised on these threads. However, I have never found it to be any benefit whatsoever. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Gloomendoom

john_white wrote: »

BMW 530i Auto RWD with 18" wheels.

It's pretty awfyul in the snow.

I only do 6000 miles ayear so may put winter tyres on all year!

Get some 'all-season' m+s tyres. They were factory fit on my car and it is perfectly usable in the snow despite 20" wheels and RWD. Keep the boot full too. It makes a difference.

sun-n-moon

Snow chains were £20 in Lidl last week. Bit of a faff to fit at first but will get you out of snow and ice.
Best car I ever had for snow was a 95 basic diesel Fiesta. Heavy engine over driving wheels shod with skinny tyres. Go anywhere.

Rolandtheroadie

ABS on ice, snow and loose surfaces increases stopping distances so it may be advantageous to be able to switch it off.

RichardD1970

scotsman4th wrote: »

ABS on ice, snow and loose surfaces increases stopping distances so it may be advantageous to be able to switch it off.

Not on ice, loose surfaces. And I would prefer to go further controlled than shorter uncontrolled.

ChiefGrasscutter

As I understood it:
M&S (mud & snow) tyres generally had just large voids in the treads.
True winter tyres had lower temperature rated 'rubber' to remain flexible as well as special tread patterns.
Studded tyres are totally different and are illegal in many countries due the damage done to the roads. Only really suitable for ice roads.

fivetide

RichardD1970 wrote: »

Not on ice, loose surfaces. And I would prefer to go further controlled than shorter uncontrolled.

Then I am afraid you don't know how to drive. You've spent a lot of time trying to say I'm wrong here but you seem to have no basis for it.

I'm an advanced driver who has done skid control in front/rear and 4x4 cars.

Why do you think the first thing they do on things like Top Gear is turn the driving aids off? Because generally if some sort of stability control is kicking in it is because you have already lost the car. Much better to actually be able to drive it and feel what is going on.

That said, the reference I made initially was to Subaru. The ABS systems can be very sensitive with the brakes pulsing because it thinks the car is going to slip, not actually slipping. Good progressive braking can work better than the ABS system on very slick surfaces. You can find that the ABS will simply not allow the brake to engage because it thinks the car will lock up!

In that situation, you putting your faith in the technology and not your own ability will be the one sliding further and being out of control!

Remember, ABS doesn't always stop you in a sgorter distance, on a dry road, locking up might well stop faster. What is does is keep the wheels moving a little so you can keep steering. Therefore, if it is doing it's job properly, then the wheels will just keep turning and you won't stop faster! does this make sense?

On a normal road surface, yes, ABS is a great thing to have but on ice or as Scotsman4th said, loose surfaces it can be a disadvantage simply because of what it actually does!

In normal driving, i have never had a car put the ABS on by the way.

A bit of referenced wikipedia for you:

In gravel, sand and deep snow, ABS tends to increase braking distances. On these surfaces, locked wheels dig in and stop the vehicle more quickly. ABS prevents this from occurring..... Some vehicle manufacturers provide an "off-road" button to turn ABS function off. The primary benefit of ABS on such surfaces is to increase the ability of the driver to maintain control of the car rather than go into a skid, though loss of control remains more likely on soft surfaces such as gravel or on slippery surfaces such as snow or ice. On a very slippery surface such as sheet ice or gravel, it is possible to lock multiple wheels at once, and this can defeat ABS (which relies on comparing all four wheels, and detecting individual wheels skidding). Availability of ABS relieves most drivers from learning threshold braking.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-lock_braking_system
So in essence, learn to brake properly! :beer:

Nerja_2

I've mentioned this before, but around here in the mountains, there are snow covered roads where it is a legal requirement to have chains to drive along. Perhaps its time the UK woke up to the idea of not driving on snow using summer tarmac tyres and trusting to luck?

Gloomendoom

All well and good, but for the average driver, turning off the ABS is a daft thing to do. Disabling by pulling the fuse may also invalidate insurance, it would certainly result in an MoT fail if tested in that condition.

ChiefGrasscutter

Nerja wrote: »

I've mentioned this before, but around here in the mountains, there are snow covered roads where it is a legal requirement to have chains to drive along. Perhaps its time the UK woke up to the idea of not driving on snow using summer tarmac tyres and trusting to luck?

good point.
In some countries use of winter rated tyres are a requirement between certain dates of the year. My friends in those places have a complete set of tyres on rims in the garage or in some storage facility if not at home and swap them over as and when required. Can you imagine that in the UK - the moaners would be having fits!

I'm sure posters will have been to places in Austria and France where at certain times/snow conditions chains are required and there are police on duty inspecting each passing car ensuring that if you want to up that road/over the pass whatever you will have chains fitted - I think they will allow 4WD vehicles without chains come to think about it.