Ripped off by my landlord?

lbiddington

We have sub-meters in my flat that we put pound coins in, in order to pay for electricity.

I have been told by my landlord that it is set at 5.6, and he promises he is not making a profit. So for every £1 we put in, we get 5.6kw on electricity?

Does this sound too high? Is there anything I can do about it?

jd87

It is set at 5.6? 5.6 what? He needs to tell you what this 5.6 means.

Does that mean 5.6 pence per kWh? This is the way electricity unit prices are normally described, and it would be very cheap.

If it means 5.6 kWh per pound, then this works out to be 17.9 pence per kWh and is expensive (but not outrageous). If the electric company charge him a standard tariff then he might be making 2-3 p/kWh profit. If he has got on a cheap deal he might be making even more profit.

Cardew

Landlords are not allowed to profit by re-selling gas or electricity.

You are paying 17.85p/kWh. Now that might well be the price he pays for the Tier1 units(kWh) on his tariff, but that is only for a maximum of 900kWh per year, so the average cost per unit will be less.

How much less depends on how much electricity is used in the flats.
Are there any other flats with sub-meters in the block and on the same supply?

If you look at his bill you can work out the average price per kWh. e.g. If he used, say 1,000kWh and the bill was £125 then the average price that you should pay is 12.5p/kWh.

The problem is that this average price will alter dependant on the amount of electricity used; the higher the amount used, the lower the price per kWh.

You can report him to Trading Standards - but I suspect you might have to find a new flat.

fed_up_and_stressed

I would ask to see his bills so you can work out what per kwh he is being charged (obviously if there is standing charge) it complicates matters however as has been pointed out he is not allowed to profit from what he charges.

Also a tenants sub meter can't be usd to power communal areas these should be a seperate service charge or included within the rent.

You have a right to a refund of any overpayment from the landlord.

If you need any furthur info contact ofgem as they regulate this specifically and they can advise you further.

lbiddington

Cardew wrote: »

Landlords are not allowed to profit by re-selling gas or electricity.

You are paying 17.85p/kWh. Now that might well be the price he pays for the Tier1 units(kWh) on his tariff, but that is only for a maximum of 900kWh per year, so the average cost per unit will be less.

How much less depends on how much electricity is used in the flats.
Are there any other flats with sub-meters in the block and on the same supply?

If you look at his bill you can work out the average price per kWh. e.g. If he used, say 1,000kWh and the bill was £125 then the average price that you should pay is 12.5p/kWh.

The problem is that this average price will alter dependant on the amount of electricity used; the higher the amount used, the lower the price per kWh.

You can report him to Trading Standards - but I suspect you might have to find a new flat.

There are 6 flats in the block. Can I ask to see his bill? Or can I go through the electricity provider and found out from them. I'm sure not if this kind of thing would be confidential.

He tried saying to me that we are only paying for the rate of electricity and it's cheaper for us as we are paying no standing charge. But I don't believe anything he says!

A few months ago he came to put our meters on a higher rate because the rate had apparantly changed. And on one of our meters he was like 'oops this one is already on the higher rate anyway!' I don't know how I'd even go about claiming it back.

fed_up_and_stressed

If the account is in his name which I suspect it is then the energy company will not give you access to his information due to Data Protection Act.

You also need to know which tarriff he is on as the energy companies have multiple tarriffs.

Best way is to ask for more information from him about what tarriff the property is on and proof of this.

If it is a communal supply and bill for multiple flats then there is no data issues on him providing the data to you because if the usuage was broken down as flat a, b etc then there would be no requirement for the sub meters !!!

As I say if you are getting no where fast with him suggest you contact ofgem.

chris1973

He tried saying to me that we are only paying for the rate of electricity and it's cheaper for us as we are paying no standing charge. But I don't believe anything he says!

Then if he is a genuine landlord and this is 100% accurate then he should have no problem showing you the last bill, or at least one from the last six months. If he is paying the main bill, then he will need to keep them for tax purposes, so don't be fobbed off with the old chestnut that he doesn't keep them or tossed them out.

If he does show you the bill and there are more than 1 flat then don't be too concerned with the usage or total units because that will be the total for all of the flats combined. What you need to find is the cost per kw/h (units).

s I say if you are getting no where fast with him suggest you contact ofgem.

Ofgem are overloaded with complaints at this time of year, and will only get involved if you have officially sent a complaint to your utility supplier and let their dispute team work with you to find a resolution, since the OP isn't even the customer of the utility company then its a non starter. If the OP really does feel the landlord is fiddling the cost in the action of 'reselling' their utilities at a higher cost, then they need to seek advice from Shelter or the CAB on what the best course of action is.

lbiddington

sniggings wrote: »

easy way to find out is find out who your supplier is for electric and ask them what a unit costs, there are a few different rates it could be on but most are near enough the same or you could just take 12p as about the average rate, then take a reading on your meter when empty, put a pound in and when it runs out take another reading, then times the units used by 12p and see if it comes to a pound, if it only comes to 50p you will then know he is charging you double the amount, you have to expect a little more in the cost as on his bill he will have a standing charge maybe but if it works out at much more than say 15p a unit you are being over charged.

I'm going to do this next time my meter runs out. Only problem is the meter is ancient, it even says 'shillings only' on it and it just has a load of dials so I would have no clue how to read it! Can you post pictures on these forums? And one of you people who are good with figures can help me out?

In fact, when I put a pound in, it doesn't register anything at all. I have to put at least 2-3 pound in before the dial moves.

sniggings

lbiddington wrote: »

I'm going to do this next time my meter runs out. Only problem is the meter is ancient, it even says 'shillings only' on it and it just has a load of dials so I would have no clue how to read it! Can you post pictures on these forums? And one of you people who are good with figures can help me out?

In fact, when I put a pound in, it doesn't register anything at all. I have to put at least 2-3 pound in before the dial moves.

if you want a very easy but time consuming way then get something you know the power usage of, say a 1kw 1.5kw or your new 2kw heater turn everything off in the flat, start with the meter empty, put one pound in and plug your heater in, make sure the heater is on heat on turned on for the full time, time how long the heater stays on for, if 5 hours and it'a the 1kw heater you have got 5 units for your £1, if you use a 2kw heater and it stays on for 2.5 hours you have got 5 units for your £1, times the units you get by the averge unit price of between 12-15p, which will give you the rate he is charging you.

A pain in the neck to do but as you say, those meters are hard to read and this is the best way to get an exact figure.

chris1973

Just ask the landlord to see his bill. If he says yes then you can see what you should be paying, if he says no or makes excuses then he's probably got something to hide, and you can look at taking the matter further to its most obvious conclusion.

There is no very personal information contained on an average utility bill so there is no reason why he can't pop around and let you look the bill over.

I echo the point that if he is paying the main bill and taking money from you, then he HAS to keep records of the transactions for tax purposes along with his rental income and other expenses, so don't be fobbed off.

misterbarlow

landlords are not allowed to do a lot of things...
but they do em....

they might not be intentionally making a profit, but they might have set it to ensure they do not lose out either...