Liability denied due to Act of God?

ClassicMad

Does anyone remember the high winds we had in January? I think it was the 18th.... well my car was parked outside my place of work and was hit by my employers wheelie bin. It was blown up a slight incline and came to rest on the wing of my car. There didn't appear to be too much damage (the light and bumper appeared to be scratched), but once it had been washed more damage was evident. It's a Renault Clio which has plastic wings. The bin had pushed the wing which had creased & caused it to "kink" and a crack is working its way from inside to the outer edge. I immediately got a quote for the work and passed it on to my employer along with a letter explaining exactly what had happened at the request of their insurer. I was told at the time that if I was desperate for the work to be carried out then I should claim via my car insurer, otherwise it would take a few weeks to sort out "as these things tend to drag". Naively I didn't even report it to my insurers... my policy was due for renewal and I didn't want it affected, as far as I was concerned it was cut and dry. Anyway, weeks have gone by and after chasing several times, an answer finally came back from the insurance company. We are not accepting liability as the high winds on that day are "AN ACT OF GOD"... So, what can I do now? My employers have offered to go 50/50 on the repair, but that's not really the point is it? At what point does weather become an AOG? Isn't it just a convenient get out clause for them? Any advice please? I've since changed car insurers too, and I don't think my old insurers would swallow a retrospective claim after this time?
Help!

Foxy106

Sorry I cant be of any help, hopefully someone else can. But i do have to say that i think insurers DO use this kind of thing as a get out clause, and they propbably dont even believe in God. Go Figure????

New_to_Budgeting

If your employers insure for storm damage, then the wind may well have to reach a certain MPH or something similar before they can pay.

If they have a wheelie bin, which is a forseeable risk in the event of high winds, kids moving it for fun, or something similar, then they should always ensure the brakes are applied or pehaps chain the bin to something in an effort to prevent incidents such as these from occurring.

If they have offered you a 'gesture of goodwill' then perhaps they realise some liability attached to the incident and I would certainly push for the full amount.

Good luck and let me know how it goes.

ClassicMad

Thanks Newtobudgeting
The insurers said that even if my employer told them to pay up they wouldn't because the incident wasn't forseeable. Since the incident happened, my employers have had a little platform made for it to stand on and bars put either side to hold it in place a little better. I have called Zurich and asked for a copy of their policy wording and their complaints procedure (which strangely havent arrived yet) and fully intend to take it further.
I'll keep you posted!

harryhound

Does your employer have a notice saying "parked at your own risk"?
Has your employer been negligent ?
How much money are we talking about anyway?
If you were parked in the street and a tree fell over crushing your car, what would you do ?

Harry.

sharkmark

Why don't you claim on your employers liability insurance instead...they've offered to go 50/50 with you - instead of paying 50/50 out of their own coffers tell them to pay the excess on the policy instead and then they should be able to claim for this...

Your car insurance company is giving you the run around and will probably end up paying if you push them but really this is your employers fault for not chaining up the bins...if you get on well with your boss have a chat with them and see how far you get - the excess might be less than half the cost of the repair so you might be saving them money too....good luck.

mattymoo

Harryhound is on the right track here.
Sharkmark - employers liability really has nothing to do with this. It is for injuries to employees.

Classicmad - you have attempted to claim off your employers insurance cover. To succeed you have to prove they were negligent in some way. To prove negligence you need to show they acted below the standard required.

That is not going to happen. The high winds are an unpredictable force over which your employer has no control. The suggestion of chaining down everything like bins and pallets is unreasonable.

It is not the insurance company you are arguing against. Your request for policy conditions / wordings is a wild goose chase. You are arguing with the English legal system.

The only option you have is to report it to your car insurers and take the hit on that - excess and loss of NCD. Alternatively, see if you can source a wing at a scrap yard. IIRC plastic wings are pretty easy to fit - being bolt on.

If your employer is prepared to pay 50% I would bite their hand off. There is no legal requirement for them to do so and they appear to be doing it for the sake of employee relations.

New_to_Budgeting

Sorry, I disagree and would go for the full amount.
They have been negligent
This was a forseeable risk - All companies I know apply brakes or make bin secure
They have taken action to prevent it from happening again
Thats as good as admitting liability

mattymoo

New_to_Budgeting wrote: »

Sorry, I disagree and would go for the full amount.
They have been negligent
This was a forseeable risk - All companies I know apply brakes or make bin secure
They have taken action to prevent it from happening again
Thats as good as admitting liability

Did you chain your wheelie bin down during the storms?
The firms you know probably secure the bins to stop them being pinched.

If the op has money to waste following this advice then fine, but he really is on a hiding to nothing.

There are two ways this can go if he persists.
His employers insurers have issued a denial of liability (under English law remember, not some insurance get out clause). He pushes them and they maintain the repudiation.

He goes after his employer, on the basis that they have already offered 50% contrary to their insurers advice. The insurers could pull the rug on the employer claiming their action (offering 50%) is prejudicial to them. In effect, this means the employer is on their own.

The OP sticks out for 100% and this will cause agro with his employer.

At the end of the day, a wing is going to cost £30-50 from a scrap dealer. Sort it that way and move on.

ClassicMad

Thanks every body for your replies, some answers/responses to earlier comments
Post #5 - no sign in the car park. The bin is frequently moved to access the up & over door and the brake was not applied. My quote for repairs is approx £600 inc vat... depending on how fussy I want to be. My car is immaculate except for this damage - the headlight has been pushed in as well as scratched & the bumper is also scratched. And if a tree fell on my car in the street then I would claim via my car insurance and/or the council.
Post #6 - Insurers have said that even if my employers agree that they were negligent in some way, they don't agree and therefore won't pay out. I haven't approached my car insurers for the reasons given above... Since the end of March I have changed insurers, and the incident was reported at the time it happened, so I don't think I have a leg to stand on with a retrospective claim (because I was led to believe that the other party would pay out)
Post #9 - The insurers have stated that they have no problem if I come to some arrangement with my employers paying out, it won't invalidate the policy as it's a private agreement between ourselves. And yes, a wing may cost £30-£50 from a scrap yard, but I don't want any old thing attached to my car (as I said the car is in very good nick), and I want a decent spray job from a reputable body shop.
Thanks!

harryhound

Let us know how it all pans out.

I remember Mrs Hound parking outside an old school in a gale and coming out to find our car was the only one in the row that had NOT had a flying tile through its windscreen.

Don't know what happened to the other unlucky drivers.

Harry