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end of tenancy is arbitration recomended?
smartfox
Posts: 2 Newbie
Hi there
I moved to London from abroad about 3 years ago. Luckily I had a relocation agent. Unaware with the customs in the UK I was shocked in which state the flat was when I moved in. However the agent arranged for an independent inventory check-in, however it is not signed by the Landlord and I can not be sure if he got it as well.
He also did a check-in report, however the first time I got to see it was today.
I could eventually persuade him to paint one wall while I paid for the decorating of the rest of the room. Also during the tenancy we had a few issues where I probably should have claimed rent reductions.
The flat has no carpets (all wooden floors) and is unfurnished.
Now to the issues at hand.
When I moved out the LL asked me to wait with the professional cleaning until some work in the flat would be finished. I sent him a mail stating that I agree under the condition that he would not charge me more than the quotes I had obtained. He did reply though without agreeing or disagreeing (he is a solicitor after all). However I could his lack of disagreement as an agreement.
The offers I got were 150 GBP for a standard end of tenancy cleaning for a 2 bed/ 2 bath. I checked as well for external window cleaning and I got one for 210 GBP. Now the LL says he paid 320 GBP and produced a receipt, however the receipt seems to be from the handyman who does works in the building. The receipt says only end of tenancy cleaning with no VAT nor does it have a date.
He said he will charge me 250 GBP whereas I offered 210 but think I should pay only 150 GBP as I did not hire them upon his request and hence we should share the costs.
But if there were no other disputes I would live up to my original 210 GBP.
I paid the same handyman 300 GBP to remove things and fill in holes (however I don't have a receipt yet). The LL claims he paid the same HM 200 GBP and charges me 100 GBP, based on his check-in/check-out report. Which says
Check-In
Light finger marks and shading throughout mid and low level
Pencil drawing mark LHS upon entrance and LHS of radiator
1 x heavy gouge to same area mid-level
Heavy rubs and scuffs LHS of patio doors to balcony throughout
1 x gouge to same area
Heavy scuffs RHS of patio doors to balcony low level
Furniture rubs far RHS mid-level
Numerous scuffs and scrapes RHS mid-level
Versus Check-Out
Pencil drawing mark not seen
Further occasional dent seen
Some heavier shading seen above radiator and to LHS doors to balcony
Some heavier scratches and marks seen below
RH light fitting and occasional crack seen near structural beams
While the Inventory Check-In I paid says
Pencil marks left hand side radiator
Heavy scuffs and grey marks throughout
Grubby marks around light switch
Scrape marks low level right hand side
Angle chip right hand side wall
Chip low level left hand side wall
Cracking far right hand side
Rub marks right hand side wall
I do not see how he can base a claim on this or can he?
Next he claims damage to the floors in the bedrooms. I agreed to a black mark, which is about 10 x 10 inches and I would pay 50 GBP but he wants to charge me 350 GBP for further damages. Which in my view are already mentioned in the check-in report.
ie Check-In
Heavy shading and wear directly upon entrance
and to main tread area leading to en suite
Scuffs and dark scratches throughout
Check-Out
Heavier scratches and scuff marks seen, notably a cluster seen 2m upon entrance in front of RH sockets and in front of entrance to balcony
Dark rectangular mark seen and some scattered dark spot marks Scratches appear generally heavy
I wonder how a Check-Out clerk can say they are heavier after 3 years, if it even was the same person.
On my Check-In report it says
Scrape marks on entry
Scuff marks
Scratches
Heavy scuffs left hand side far Balcony door
Marks consistent with age
Wear and tear
For another room my Check-In report says
Heavy scuffs and scratches
Large patch front of Balcony door
Marks consistent with age
Wear and tear
Purple stain to centre
his Check-In noted
Heavy shading upon entrance
Heavy shading in front of entrance to balcony
Various dark scuffs and scratches throughout
vs Check-Out
Continuation of heavy wear seen w/ heavy
scratches seen in patches throughout, heaviest in front of radiator
Occasional blemish
he wants to charge me for the heaviest in front of radiator ...
etc.
I also asked him twice when the end of tenancy check-out would happen, however he did not tell me and I thus could not attend. However it says in my tenancy agreement that I have to pay for it (140 GBP) so I guess I will pay that.
Overall he says he is entitled to over 1200, however he is charging me only 700 quid. I offered him 300-350 quid. Which I feel is still a lot as nothing was done to improve the flat when I moved in.
There are quite a few friends who had some experience with the LL and he seems to try and make out a few quids if he can. And all the receipts other than the Check-Out report have no VAT nor do they look proper.
Hence I don't want to pay him to much. Oh and I got his updated second mail regarding his claims today 7 weeks after I have moved out.
Does it make sense to go to arbitration or will I likely have to pay more?
many thanks
I moved to London from abroad about 3 years ago. Luckily I had a relocation agent. Unaware with the customs in the UK I was shocked in which state the flat was when I moved in. However the agent arranged for an independent inventory check-in, however it is not signed by the Landlord and I can not be sure if he got it as well.
He also did a check-in report, however the first time I got to see it was today.
I could eventually persuade him to paint one wall while I paid for the decorating of the rest of the room. Also during the tenancy we had a few issues where I probably should have claimed rent reductions.
The flat has no carpets (all wooden floors) and is unfurnished.
Now to the issues at hand.
When I moved out the LL asked me to wait with the professional cleaning until some work in the flat would be finished. I sent him a mail stating that I agree under the condition that he would not charge me more than the quotes I had obtained. He did reply though without agreeing or disagreeing (he is a solicitor after all). However I could his lack of disagreement as an agreement.
The offers I got were 150 GBP for a standard end of tenancy cleaning for a 2 bed/ 2 bath. I checked as well for external window cleaning and I got one for 210 GBP. Now the LL says he paid 320 GBP and produced a receipt, however the receipt seems to be from the handyman who does works in the building. The receipt says only end of tenancy cleaning with no VAT nor does it have a date.
He said he will charge me 250 GBP whereas I offered 210 but think I should pay only 150 GBP as I did not hire them upon his request and hence we should share the costs.
But if there were no other disputes I would live up to my original 210 GBP.
I paid the same handyman 300 GBP to remove things and fill in holes (however I don't have a receipt yet). The LL claims he paid the same HM 200 GBP and charges me 100 GBP, based on his check-in/check-out report. Which says
Check-In
Light finger marks and shading throughout mid and low level
Pencil drawing mark LHS upon entrance and LHS of radiator
1 x heavy gouge to same area mid-level
Heavy rubs and scuffs LHS of patio doors to balcony throughout
1 x gouge to same area
Heavy scuffs RHS of patio doors to balcony low level
Furniture rubs far RHS mid-level
Numerous scuffs and scrapes RHS mid-level
Versus Check-Out
Pencil drawing mark not seen
Further occasional dent seen
Some heavier shading seen above radiator and to LHS doors to balcony
Some heavier scratches and marks seen below
RH light fitting and occasional crack seen near structural beams
While the Inventory Check-In I paid says
Pencil marks left hand side radiator
Heavy scuffs and grey marks throughout
Grubby marks around light switch
Scrape marks low level right hand side
Angle chip right hand side wall
Chip low level left hand side wall
Cracking far right hand side
Rub marks right hand side wall
I do not see how he can base a claim on this or can he?
Next he claims damage to the floors in the bedrooms. I agreed to a black mark, which is about 10 x 10 inches and I would pay 50 GBP but he wants to charge me 350 GBP for further damages. Which in my view are already mentioned in the check-in report.
ie Check-In
Heavy shading and wear directly upon entrance
and to main tread area leading to en suite
Scuffs and dark scratches throughout
Check-Out
Heavier scratches and scuff marks seen, notably a cluster seen 2m upon entrance in front of RH sockets and in front of entrance to balcony
Dark rectangular mark seen and some scattered dark spot marks Scratches appear generally heavy
I wonder how a Check-Out clerk can say they are heavier after 3 years, if it even was the same person.
On my Check-In report it says
Scrape marks on entry
Scuff marks
Scratches
Heavy scuffs left hand side far Balcony door
Marks consistent with age
Wear and tear
For another room my Check-In report says
Heavy scuffs and scratches
Large patch front of Balcony door
Marks consistent with age
Wear and tear
Purple stain to centre
his Check-In noted
Heavy shading upon entrance
Heavy shading in front of entrance to balcony
Various dark scuffs and scratches throughout
vs Check-Out
Continuation of heavy wear seen w/ heavy
scratches seen in patches throughout, heaviest in front of radiator
Occasional blemish
he wants to charge me for the heaviest in front of radiator ...
etc.
I also asked him twice when the end of tenancy check-out would happen, however he did not tell me and I thus could not attend. However it says in my tenancy agreement that I have to pay for it (140 GBP) so I guess I will pay that.
Overall he says he is entitled to over 1200, however he is charging me only 700 quid. I offered him 300-350 quid. Which I feel is still a lot as nothing was done to improve the flat when I moved in.
There are quite a few friends who had some experience with the LL and he seems to try and make out a few quids if he can. And all the receipts other than the Check-Out report have no VAT nor do they look proper.
Hence I don't want to pay him to much. Oh and I got his updated second mail regarding his claims today 7 weeks after I have moved out.
Does it make sense to go to arbitration or will I likely have to pay more?
many thanks
0
Comments
-
* What country are you in? Eng, Wales, Scotland?
* did you pay a deposit?
* What date?
* Was the deposit registered in one of the 3 approved schemes?
* which one?
* on what date was it registered?
* were you given the 'prescribed information' for the scheme?
* what date?
Did you sign/approve the check-in inventory? If not, it cannot be relied on by the LL
A LL cannot require professional cleaning, or anything other than return of the property as it was at the start (less fair wear and tear).
A LL cannot claim 'betterment' - ie improvement.
If you disagree with the LL's deductions, register a dispute with the scheme.0 -
thanks very much for the quick reply
* What country are you in? Eng, Wales, Scotland?
Central London
* did you pay a deposit?
I paid a deposit in Nov 2009
* What date?
* Was the deposit registered in one of the 3 approved schemes?
Not sure, I paid it to Hamptons
* which one?
* on what date was it registered?
* were you given the 'prescribed information' for the scheme?
Not that I am aware of.
I only see in the Lease Agreement that any dispute will be referred to either:
the dispute will be referred to the Association of Residential Letting Agents (“ARLA”) or to the Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors (RICS), or the Dispute Service or relevant deposit scheme of which the Agent is a member
So whatever has been agreed, I will check with Hamptons if I can get this information.
* what date?
Did you sign/approve the check-in inventory? If not, it cannot be relied on by the LL
I did see the check-in inventory for the first time yesterday, so I did not sign it.
A LL cannot require professional cleaning, or anything other than return of the property as it was at the start (less fair wear and tear).
Ok thanks I am more annoyed that I thought we have an agreement as to how much I pay and then he produces a phoney receipt which is 150% of the amount I thought we agreed upon as a maximum.
Thanks again for taking the time.0
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