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Sterlingtimes

The FIT unlike the RPI linked annuity is tax free and it potentially pays out after death.

Cardew

Sterlingtimes wrote: »

The FIT unlike the RPI linked annuity is tax free and it potentially pays out after death.

I agree that an annuity better describes an investment in solar, than calling it a 'rate of return'.


However as you point out above there are several differences.


On the negative side the majority of the solar income ceases after 20 years whereas an annuity income lasts until death.


Also it is possible/probable that solar will require expensive repairs during the 20 years.

EricMears

michaels wrote: »

Once upon a time the average life expectancy on retirement was less than 10 years and at the same time bond yields were in the double digits. Fortuately neither of these are now true.

Quite so, but annuity rates used to be significantly better than the best simple deposited cash accounts; now they rarely match the return you could get on retaining ownership and depositing funds.

silverwhistle

Cardew wrote: »

On the negative side the majority of the solar income ceases after 20 years whereas an annuity income lasts until death.

Also it is possible/probable that solar will require expensive repairs during the 20 years.

Ever the optimist! Having any income on a long ammortised piece of capital equipment seems a pretty good deal, and I suspect advances in efficiency of all the consuming equipment will make up for declines in efficiency of the panels themselves. Who knows what will happen; new battery technologies or panel efficiencies continuing to improve may change the game.

As for expensive repairs, that's a worry I associate with rapidly depreciating cars. Over 20 years quite a few of them, I would imagine, even with the cheap model second-hand ones I buy and run until uneconomical to repair.

You also have to remember that many of us aren't accountants, and although we look at (and have to look at) the payback also have other more idealistic motivations which are added to the balance sheet, whatever some of the more cynical on here may say.

Martyn1981

News item on PV and storage trials in the UK by Western Power Distribution

Western Power Distribution’s ‘fully-wrapped’ deal for project commercialising solar storage with RES


Edit: And another item on large scale storage too.

UK's largest battery energy storage array comes online

Mart.

Martyn1981

@ Zeupater.

Do you remember us talking a year or so back, about PV generation matching hydro generation in the near future.

Well, it occurred to me that PV capacity at the end of 2015 was high enough for generation to exceed hydro in 2016, but I wasn't sure if generation in 2015 would be, due to install dates.

Anyways, here's an article, if you're still interested with PV, hydro and other generation figures:

UK: solar outshines hydro, drives down coal in 2015

Mart.

Martyn1981

Solar Power Now Cheaper Than Coal In India, Says Energy Minister

And that's before externalities of coal, such as pollution and CO2. Though I assume it's before PV externalities, such as grid back up and potential storage costs (in the longer term).

Mart.

Cardew

India - that's interesting; don't they have more sunshine than GB?


Still needs a subsidy in UK!

EricMears

Cardew wrote: »

India - that's interesting; don't they have more sunshine than GB?

Of course they do. But they also have a lot more coal mines and don't pay their miners anything like as much as UK miners used to get.

Cardew

Some figures about renewable energy in Estonia in case The Guru hasn't read them.


http://www.ies.ee/iesp/No11/articles/02_Runno_Lumiste.pdf


A little out of date, but compelling reading.