Does a Consultation Period Protect the Jobs Affected

mrobsessed

Hi All,

I work for a large multi-national company which has just announced 110 job losses spread over numerous sites in the UK. In my case this means it is likely my entire department will be shut down with the work going abroad.

The paperwork supplied by the company has been extensive but rather vague. All it says is that a consultation period is being entered into and that employees leaving will be phased over 2 to 9 months.

As I understand it, if more than 100 job losses are made a 90 day consultation period is legally required, but this has not been mentioned specifically in the paperwork.

My question is - does this still count if the job losses are at more than one site? Also, does the consultation period mean that the people affected are safe from being 'finished up' until it ends? Does this still apply if there is no work to do?

We suspect that the extended consualtation period is to encourage people to move on to new jobs of their own accord, thus avoiding expensive redundancy payments - but at what point can we be legally forced out?

At first is was strongly implied that staff were obliged to take lower paid unskilled jobs or would not be entitled to severance pay and the company WOULD NOT discuss payments - is this legal?

Many thanks for any advice.
Mr O

Sycorax

mrobsessed wrote: »

Hi All,



As I understand it, if more than 100 job losses are made a 90 day consultation period is legally required, but this has not been mentioned specifically in the paperwork.

My question is - does this still count if the job losses are at more than one site? Also, does the consultation period mean that the people affected are safe from being 'finished up' until it ends? Does this still apply if there is no work to do?

We suspect that the extended consualtation period is to encourage people to move on to new jobs of their own accord, thus avoiding expensive redundancy payments - but at what point can we be legally forced out?

At first is was strongly implied that staff were obliged to take lower paid unskilled jobs or would not be entitled to severance pay and the company WOULD NOT discuss payments - is this legal?

Many thanks for any advice.
Mr O

It is the case that more than 100 employees being made redundant requires 90 days notice. However, depending on the set up of the company each site can be classed as a seperate management unit. Things that would put them in this category would be things like autonomy over decision making, approval of hiring, expense claims, profit and loss accountability etc.
I used to work for a (multi) national hotel company and each hotel was legitimately classed as separate units as each had their own P&L etc.

It is possible that the notice period can be included in the 90 consultation, so with the separate management units and notice periods being included it means the duration of consultation could vary.

You can be put on 'gardening leave' during the consultation and you can agree to waive the consultation period in which case you would be paid for it, so if after 30 days it's obvious there is not opportunity for redployment you could agree to waive the next 60 days consultation and take the cash instead. But that would need agreement from both employer and employee (this payment would also be subject to tax and N.I and any holidays etc should still be calculated up until the end of the 'official' consultation period.

You can only be legally made redundant at the end of the consultation period.

Employers are obliged to offer any jobs to people facing potential redundancy. However, they can't force you to take it unless they can prove that it is a suitable alternative. By that it means the job has to be substantially similar in pay, responsibility, location, working conditions etc.
Also if you do accept another job you are legally entitled to a 4 week grace period, if at the end of that you decide the job isn't for you, you can still claim redundancy.

SarEl

Sycorax wrote: »

It is the case that more than 100 employees being made redundant requires 90 days notice. In any one establishment. However, depending on the set up of the company each site can be classed as a seperate management unit. Things that would put them in this category would be things like autonomy over decision making, approval of hiring, expense claims, profit and loss accountability etc.
I used to work for a (multi) national hotel company and each hotel was legitimately classed as separate units as each had their own P&L etc. This would not be an applicable test in law however - the law assumes one establishment unless the employer can prove otherwise - and it is very hard o to. What the employer tells you, and what is a fcat, are not the same thing,

It is possible that the notice period can be included in the 90 consultation, so with the separate management units and notice periods being included it means the duration of consultation could vary. No, they can't. Notice cannot be served until after the statutory consultation period.

You can be put on 'gardening leave' during the consultation and you can agree to waive the consultation period in which case you would be paid for it, so if after 30 days it's obvious there is not opportunity for redployment you could agree to waive the next 60 days consultation and take the cash instead. But that would need agreement from both employer and employee (this payment would also be subject to tax and N.I and any holidays etc should still be calculated up until the end of the 'official' consultation period. No. The regulations for PILON - mutual termination of contract - depend on contractual terms and/ or custom and practice.

You can only be legally made redundant at the end of the consultation period.

Employers are obliged to offer any jobs to people facing potential redundancy. No they are not. They are only required to offer suitable alternative positions - not any job. However, they can't force you to take it unless they can prove that it is a suitable alternative. By that it means the job has to be substantially similar in pay, responsibility, location, working conditions etc.

Also if you do accept another job you are legally entitled to a 4 week grace period, if at the end of that you decide the job isn't for you, you can still claim redundancy. No you are not. If you agree to accept a job as a suitable aletrantive position you are entitled in law to a four week trial period - or to a period mutually agreed of more than four weeks. Unreasoable refusal of the position means that you are not entitled to redundancy pay.

Not quite entirely correct, It is now.

mrobsessed

Thanks for the advice, both.

I am still uncertain about wether a 90 day consultation period applies, although it looks likely. As far as I know, all major decisions come from head office and the type of jobs affected by the decision are all of the same type nationally, albeit spread over a number of sites and the announcment was made simultaneously.

Is a company legally obliged to give us specific dates for the duration of the consultation period? As I have already mentioned they have not done so and have just mentioned that a consultaion period has been entered into and given a vague timescale (2 to 9 months) where jobs will be phased out.

Thanks again for your help.

Mr O

getmore4less

I think one thing that should happen if this is collective is the identification of reps, either union or currently elected or newly elected.

Consultation is a two way process get involved so you know what is happening

Two key events will be the termination notice and termination date.

Work out your relevent service for both and any key dates like you had a start date in the early part of the year.

with the end of tax year coming up a final date in this or next tax year could be significant depending on the size of the package

I would focus on the options.

if they are planning outsourcing and closing the office is that worth fighting if not it is find another job.

do you want to stay, then look for other opportunities and try to get in first

or go, start preparing for the departure, CV upto date etc. remember there are a load of people about to hit the job market with similar skills background.

other things to consider are handover/traning opportunies, to help drag things out might also be able to negotiate retention bonus.

Also be prepared for finding another job quickly, get familiar with the rules/timing around counternotice. and think about the package if small it may not be worth staying if a good job comes up.

Gentoo365

*post removed so as to not confuse things*

getmore4less

best to start a new thread it will just get confusing.
once started you can delete your post here.