Any other home buyers in NI?

saverbuyer

motorguy wrote: »

So summarising, you're afraid to buy in case you get burnt?

If that is the case what would be wrong with that? At 3% growth you could hold off for 20 years (not including house owning costs) and still be in a better position than someone who bought in 2007-2009.

There are too many potential upsets on the horizon for me, I see little having changed since 2007 and I'm worried about what low interest rates and a popping of a London bubble will do here. I'm happy to pay a few thousand for peace of mind.

saverbuyer

[QUOTE=motorguy;6473449

Makes you wonder if these people were ever in the position to buy in the first place - either because of financial constraints, borrowing limitations or personal constraints.

It just seems odd to me that people with very sizeable lump sums sitting around and prices as cheap as they are as likely to be are finding all these excuses not to buy. Just doesnt stack up to me.

Again, each to their own. I'm renting out our previous house to a guy who has always rented houses, always intended to. Great long term tenant, and hes paying my mortgage for me. So i'm happy.

From his perspective hes had none of the worries or concerns of the housing market. So hes happy.[/QUOTE]

People take different attitudes to risk, you're more of a jump in and see sort of person. Having the money which is tangible and is yours definitely changes your attitude compared to borrowed bank money. I'll admit when you look at money coming in from interest and dividends it effects the decisions you make.

I definitively wasn't in the position I'm in now in 2007 - 2009. There would have been no option of buying for cash, but hard there been I still would have held off.

qwert_yuiop

motorguy wrote: »

So summarising, you're afraid to buy in case you get burnt?

No. My money is doing a lot better elsewhere. I like the house I rent. I'll buy when I want to, and not because some bloke who tied not one but two millstones round his neck several years ago has convinced himself it's a good time to buy, he's smarter than me, and he knows what's going to happen next.

Congratulations on getting a good tenant. Pity about the last one.

I'm impressed by your confidence, given all that's happened. It's strange how you tell us how cheap houses are if they're rising. What does it matter if the renter is still renting if their capital was better employed elsewhere?

A renter does not need to justify their behaviour. The buyer does (if they think they're being financially cute) have to justify their belief in all that estate agent guff about "never a better time to buy". Yawn.

A.L.D.A

warmhands.coldheart wrote: »

40,000 on the waiting list.... with half in Housing stress, yeah right...... First of all, how many actually truly are in "Housing Stress" and how many are on the list just to get a Housing association house rather than rent privately, that's the real question...... I know of about 5 couples over the last 5 years who were on the housing list. Out of these 5, 4 could easily have rented privately as all were in work. Needless to say these 4 couples were not married and had a minimum of 1 child so the mothers all applied for housing as a single parent..... In one year 2 of the couples got married and went on to buy houses in that same year........ Now that is NOT housing need in my book, that is abusing the system.......

I agree the system is abused and Housing Associations all have their own agenda, but to my way of thinking it indicates possible levels of demand. As you say many can afford to buy and some do.

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

Any one buying a house now having lived through the last 7 years cannot be assured that the whole meltdown will not happen again. Therefore the decision must be based on grounds other than economic. I bought a new pair of shoes the other day. Not a sensible decision business wise. I still bought them. Likewise there is no reason to buy a jag when a fiesta will carry you around just as well. People still buy jags. The same thinking may apply on house purchase.

But meltdown could happen to any investment and any currency?

I wouldn't argue that buying a house is a good investment, but how many look at it that way? In all probability (IMO) house prices are more likely to increase than decrease in the year ahead. If you rent there are costs and negative factors, if you buy other liabilities to balance. In the end is the decision most make based on money alone? Indeed for most what part does cost really play beyond can we afford it? Markets do not behave on logic they behave like a herd and the herd is turning unless something spokes it.

qwert_yuiop

motorguy wrote: »

Why?

You're taking little risk buying at the bottom of the market, and who gives a hoot what happens to prices after you've actually bought?

You're £100K house might hit a million in five years time, or it might drop back to £50K, but who gives a stuff? You just keep paying your mortgage on your own home, afterwhich you OWN it. It might be worth £200,000 then, or it might be worth £10,000 then. Its still your home to do with as you please.

OR you could just keep renting someone elses house.

It matters quite a lot when you're flushing several hundred a month unnecessarily into a large toilet bowl marked "Bank" and you're struggling financially.
I see no advantage in being in the position of those who bought in 2007 which is exactly what you've described. What a ludicrous thing for a "fervent money saver" (or anyone else) to say. Take it you bought in the bubble. Keep whistling.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

If that is the case what would be wrong with that? At 3% growth you could hold off for 20 years (not including house owning costs) and still be in a better position than someone who bought in 2007-2009.

Yes. Absolutely. But we're not in 2007 now. House prices are a fraction of that price. If you were to hold off from now and not buy for 20 years, but rent instead, by that time you could have a house paid off and it would be yours?

saverbuyer wrote: »

There are too many potential upsets on the horizon for me, I see little having changed since 2007 and I'm worried about what low interest rates and a popping of a London bubble will do here. I'm happy to pay a few thousand for peace of mind.

A lot has changed since 2007 - house prices are a fraction of what they were, the economy is showing real signs of recovery, banks are becoming more relaxed about lending, etc, etc.

If you're more comfortable not, then fair enough. "owning" your own home is not an essential. But i doubt there will be better buying conditions than we're seeing now.

motorguy

saverbuyer wrote: »

People take different attitudes to risk, you're more of a jump in and see sort of person. Having the money which is tangible and is yours definitely changes your attitude compared to borrowed bank money. I'll admit when you look at money coming in from interest and dividends it effects the decisions you make.

I definitively wasn't in the position I'm in now in 2007 - 2009. There would have been no option of buying for cash, but hard there been I still would have held off.

Yes, totally agree.

I've weathered the storm, been in it, got through it, survived it. Have come out the other side.

Wouldnt think twice about selling up and buying something else if it suited to do so.

And totally agree RE: hard cash. Theres a big difference between money in equity, and actual physical hard cash.

Can see your point entirely.

But its a forum and fun to debate.

marathonic

saverbuyer wrote: »

If that is the case what would be wrong with that? At 3% growth you could hold off for 20 years (not including house owning costs) and still be in a better position than someone who bought in 2007-2009.

Again, comparisons to 2007-2009 to justify the decision whether or not to buy today. Get that out of your head. It's been and gone. It's history.

Similarly, I see people thinking they made a great decision in buying because the house price is 50% of what it was 7 years ago - forget 2007 and look at the numbers today.

marathonic

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

I see no advantage in being in the position of those who bought in 2007

And again!!!!

Even anecdotally, I have a friend who purchased at the peak and another who has not yet purchased. The friend who hasn't yet purchased is afraid to make the leap because the other friend told them it's the worst mistake of their life.

Of course it was the worst mistake of their life. They purchased at a time when the market rents wouldn't even remotely cover the interest portion of a mortgage. Things are different today and I doubt the people who don't get that will ever purchase. They'll just wait until we're halfway through the next boom whilsting ranting and raving about a 'dead-cat bounce'.

motorguy

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

No. My money is doing a lot better elsewhere. I like the house I rent. I'll buy when I want to,

Of course you will. And in the meantime we can debate the situation on forums. It doesnt matter to me if you dont buy, and it doesnt matter to you that i have. Its just something to talk about really - but very interesting to see how peoples "justificiations to not buy" has changed on here over the years.

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

and not because some bloke who tied not one but two millstones round his neck several years ago has convinced himself it's a good time to buy, he's smarter than me, and he knows what's going to happen next.

Yes, feeling very fortunate that we were financially able to weather the storm and that we had bought or built at the right time - i know a lot of people who bought at the wrong time, who sadly, have lost out.

when you're trying to have a pop at me, get ALL the facts in - include the house i sold at the peak of the market in April 2007, having bought it for £100K less 3 years before.

And where are all the REAL property investors now? Quietly buying up the cheap houses and quietly waiting. Just like they did years ago before everyone thought they were a property mogul.

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

Congratulations on getting a good tenant. Pity about the last one.

There are good tenants, and bad tenants. I'm sure your landlord has an opinion on you. And the day it doesnt suit him to have you there, you'll be out on your butt cheeks.

Last (first tenant) was a victim of the crashed market in the south when the company his pension was with went bust. Ended up not being able to pay rent for three months before he had to leave. Sad for him and sad for us. Lost 3 months rent but we had a months rent as deposit, so two months lost. All in the distant past now.

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

I'm impressed by your confidence, given all that's happened. It's strange how you tell us how cheap houses are if they're rising. What does it matter if the renter is still renting if their capital was better employed elsewhere?

Yes, of course they're cheap - starting to rise. That would make it a good time to buy - now that the corner has been turned, would it not?

qwert_yuiop wrote: »

A renter does not need to justify their behaviour. The buyer does (if they think they're being financially cute) have to justify their belief in all that estate agent guff about "never a better time to buy". Yawn.

But the renters on here ARE justifying their behaviour. Justifying when the thread started (quite rightly) that it was the wrong time to buy, justifying how a year ago it was the wrong time to buy (when the market seemed to be bottoming out), justifying NOW why its the wrong time to buy (when the market seems to be moving UP), and no doubt will continue to justify WHY they didnt buy at a particular time, but are really happy renting.

Interesting though that you consider yourself a "renter" now, moreso than a "prospective buyer".

I think that speaks volumes.