Be cautious with value lines

A._Badger

stephen77 wrote: »

read the part where I said "top line".
There will be individual cases of products changing price.

Plus will vary a little on the manufacturer. If eg js and tesco use the same manufacturer, it may depend on that companies ability to source the raw material. If they are using other suppliers to each other with eg on in the UK and other in Euro zone, it may be down to exchange rate movements. Thus one will have to move sooner.
But generally the top line is the order I mentioned above.

I watch prices quite closely, I have seen no evidence that what you suggest is true. Rather I see the market being driven by the largest and most aggressive retailer, Tesco, against which all the others set their pricing, both in private and publicly.

LittleMax

stephen77 wrote: »

I think your @rse about face are the wrong way round.
This is about price rises. Not prices decreases.

If this was not the cases. Why have meeting outcomes about prices rises when food inflation was running high.
The results of the meeting being, we are waiting for M&S/waitrose to put there prices up before we can increase our prices to maintain our margins.

Price increases would generally be passed on to the customer when suppliers increase their prices. Again it is Tesco's volume that means they are able to exert more pressure on the suppliers not to increase the price to Tesco for as long as possible. So prices would rise in the smaller retailers first, who do not have the influence on the suppliers.

It is well documented how Tesco treat farmers ... well they treat other food manufacturers like this too.

When items go on offer it is not the retailers that are cutting prices it is the manufacturer.

A._Badger

HappyMJ wrote: »

Tesco Value Vodka @ £9.85 is a product that I will not purchase. Single distilled...no chance. It got a -174 on hotukdeals as an extremely bad product similar to paint stripper.

The triple distilled Tesco Vodka 700ml @ £11.20 is a much better product...but for only 7% more I can pick up Smirnoff Vodka @ £12.00 I'll be picking Smirnoff based on today's pricing.

Whatever you do, don't risk the 'Russian Standard' stuff that Sainsbury was selling at about 13 a litre recently. Polycell would be proud!

stephen77

A._Badger wrote: »

I watch prices quite closely, I have seen no evidence that what you suggest is true. Rather I see the market being driven by the largest and most aggressive retailer, Tesco, against which all the others set their pricing, both in private and publicly.

The evidence comes from retail buyers / sales directors of food companies when discussing prices and when they can increase the MSP & RSP.

ASDA do not want to sell a comparable product for more than M&S do.

geordie_joe

A._Badger wrote: »

I watch prices quite closely, I have seen no evidence that what you suggest is true. Rather I see the market being driven by the largest and most aggressive retailer, Tesco, against which all the others set their pricing, both in private and publicly.

Lets look at it.

Value coffee was 47p in Tesco, Morrisons, ASDA and Sainsburys.

Tesco increased the price to 53p, then Morrisons increased it to 73p.

Lets see what ASDA and Sainsburys do.

stephen77

LittleMax wrote: »

Price increases would generally be passed on to the customer when suppliers increase their prices. Again it is Tesco's volume that means they are able to exert more pressure on the suppliers not to increase the price to Tesco for as long as possible. So prices would rise in the smaller retailers first, who do not have the influence on the suppliers.

It is well documented how Tesco treat farmers ... well they treat other food manufacturers like this too.
.

Prices are generally passed on to the consumer. All the retailers will try and keep prices down for as long as possible. M&S and Waitrose will do the same.

Your missing the point. Once M&S and Waitrose have increased the price. The other supermakets can follow suit. Till they increase their prices your less likely to get Tesco increasing there prices especially if means a Tesco Item will cost more than the M&S equivlent.
Thats why they hold the key to "price increases". I did not say they have the most power in setting the rough price range for ingredient x, which Tesco will have a big say in that.

Just because RSP have changed it does not always mean the MSP has remained the same and vice versa.

From my personally shopping experience I find ASDA cheaper than tesco on the items I buy, not seen the independant price comparrison advert for a while that generally had ASDA winning most weeks.

Owain_Moneysaver

geordie_joe wrote: »

If they don't make a profit on their value ranges why have they spent so much on rebranding them and encouraging us to buy them? Why have Tesco introduced over 550 new Everyday Value lines this year.

Because if your shopping usually costs £50 but you change to Value and it costs £40, you'll use the £10 you've saved to treat yourself to some Value Cheesecake and Value Icecream and Value Biscuits ... you'll still end up spending £50 at Tesco.

Also, the presence of Value ranges reinforces the perception that Tesco offer low prices even if you don't buy Value products. "Ooh look, value coffee's only 11p" you think as you reach for the nescafe not noticing that the nescafe's 10p more than it was last week.

gailey_2

Tesco have been at the forefront of retail many years reasons why

They ruthless.

They were one of the 1st to offer differentiated own brand ie

premuim-finest
normal own brand
value own brand

they now also brought in other cheaper branded items in larger stores called daisy and suppost to be dedicating space in their store to compete with lidls/aldis-not sure how this has gone.

Most of there stores are huge now too big for me and they 1st to have diffrent formats

express -they led way convieniance and could trade for longer.
metro-use to be average size tesco in town centre.
superstore-what we used to shop at until knocked down and built huge extras.

Also besar in mind prices for sme product may vary in each.

When I worked for somerfeild there were 3branches on 1 long road.
1 nearest city centre was classes as convioneinace and had posher ranges in and was diffrent prices to store opposite end of rd. customers noticed. Then the petrol station shop more pricey again.
Im sure tesco do the same you pay the most in express and metro-they the ones easiet to get to minus car.

They now have stand alone home stores too.

I do ofren wonder if geographically prices vary? is sme item in tesco london more than leeds? only say this as people on os board go on about 4, 9p bargains taht never seen in ours.

ruthless expansion- even when locals against, dont treat staff or suppliers well. genrally always had ok customer srevice and they have less self service tills.

Another thing mr s dont get -they rapidly annoying me and losing my custom they my nearest superstore is service its dire they jow have 2banks of self service tills, people running up and down with headsets no extra staff put on.There was once a time could even get help packing not anymore and availaibility in my local one very patchy.I would pay a bit more if was nicer to shop as when got 3kids with me really appreciate it.

In comtrast when we st changed to aldis/lidls i hated it felt shunted aside and pressured but now I love it as genrally

Theres 1 person on shop floor to ask questions and they take me to the product.
It doesnt take me long to get round.
Actually packing it to one side and doing in my own time less stress im not holding anyone up.
If more than 2/3 queue they alwys open another checkout unlike sainsburys.
The staff always pleasent alays blessed with speedy and polite cashiers.

Theres not as many retail mind games where things are places ie what shelf. whats at fromt, they dont move sections around all the time,the prices dont yoyo every week and the deals are limited but streamlined so i can pick up a leaflet or check online and select and not miss deals.

Its why i think these days bar a few products they better value than value ranges.

I brought happy shopper window cleaner from local shop and its rubbsih jow will look out for windolene in £1 shop.

Brought 2sprays in co-op today own brand multibuy 2 for £1.60 which probably works out cheaper than £1 shop.

noticed radox half price tesco so whole 6p cheaper than poundshop .

think make a list see what it is in boots/superdrug/big 4 if not on offer then £1 shop best option but takes time and my supermarlet excludes so many.


Even my local corner shops have £1 section.

High street postoiffice mcols has milk for £1 so cheaper than co-op next door or sainsburys local opposite.

As for shops considered more expensive. M&s have some fab deals and we sometimes do waitrose online and really rate their essential range which they claim not a value product. Ocado with codes orks out cheaper than tesco.

Asda i dont really like store, their range and get so stressed i discount that. Morrsions is very limiting unless its larger store and dont think theuir fruita dn veg offers good value as dont last 5mins.

geordie_joe

Originally Posted by geordie joe
If they don't make a profit on their value ranges why have they spent so much on rebranding them and encouraging us to buy them? Why have Tesco introduced over 550 new Everyday Value lines this year.

Owain_Moneysaver wrote: »

Because if your shopping usually costs £50 but you change to Value and it costs £40, you'll use the £10 you've saved to treat yourself to some Value Cheesecake and Value Icecream and Value Biscuits ... you'll still end up spending £50 at Tesco.

But you are spending £50 on Value stuff that they don't make a profit on!

Why would they encourage you to change from a brand they make a profit on to one they don't?

Owain_Moneysaver wrote: »

Also, the presence of Value ranges reinforces the perception that Tesco offer low prices even if you don't buy Value products. "Ooh look, value coffee's only 11p" you think as you reach for the nescafe not noticing that the nescafe's 10p more than it was last week.

What if you think "Ooh look, value coffee's only 11p" and reach for that ignoring the Nescafe? Then repeat for the other 550 new value lines plus the old value lines too.

Edwardia

As a college-trained ex-chef I've always been interested in good food. A month after moving in with my fiance I was made redundant and because we lived together I couldn't get benefits.

Suddenly, after a lifetime of having the best of everything I came face to face with Tesco Value burgers, made with mechanically recovered chicken meat. The cooking smell was more of a stench, and neither me or the OH (brought up on a council estate) could eat them and nor would the Jack Russell. I cried. We ate veggie 5 nights a week after that.

So yes I realise that these value ranges contain a load of old rubbish and I don't believe anyone who says they don't make supermarkets money. Mechanically recovered chicken meat is borderline throw it away, it's got to be dirt cheap, not much better than pink slime.

I'm not a food chemist, but some of these chemicals in meat are used to bind ingredients together. You can put breaded chicken portions on the front and then in the ingredients state 89% chicken and a load of gunk which is used to bind all the chicken bits together into a chicken shape which is then breaded to disguise it. That's legal because they haven't been described as 100% chicken or chicken breast fillets.

When people tell me water is added for succulence I :rotfl:then because if you are Tesco and add 10% water to every pack of chicken breasts, you're making 100% profit on every eleventh one sold. If you're adding sugar and salt and water, it's because the meat is tough, and you're trying to tenderise it to disguise the fatc that it's cheap rubbish.