Another AXA rejection

SuePritchard

I had my iphone and ipad stolen when I was at Ashridge Business School last week. This is a very secure building with security on the doors and no public access - there have been no thefts there in 7 years.... I used the tracker app and traced them, about five hours later, to an address about 20 miles away. The police obtained warrants and sent a search team but the address turned out to belong to a little old lady, suggesting that the thieves knew what they were doing when they turned them on (and off again) there. Meanwhile I reported the theft to Swiftcover AXA. The claims assessor has now declined my claim on the basis that I couldn't be absolutely certain that I hadn't left them somewhere unattended and that I put my bag down under the table in the restaurant to collect food from the buffet (about two tables away) and where my colleagues were sitting. I think this is unreasonable, in order to get out of paying. I've been frank and open in my description of what happened and what I can recollect with absolute certainty. They seem to have used this to look for a way to avoid settling. Surely insurers can't really expect you to carry a big bag whilst collecting food from a buffet when you need both hands, especially in a secure, private establishment..?!?

Faith177

Most companies want you to act with due care towards your possessions. You are meant to take every precaution to keep your property safe.

Most companies will decline a claim where by the owner has just walked away and left their items unattended.

SuePritchard

Absolutely. And there is also, surely, a test of reasonableness and fairness in context. So if I'd put my bag down in the centre of pub and walked off, fair enough. But when I put my bag down in the restaurant of a private, secure, business school where I work, within my line of sight and my colleagues....? The point is, I don't know when or how it was stolen, but that the insurers were clearly only interested in looking for a point in my narrative when they could decline cover.

*Scarlett

It may be a private and secure school but even so there may still be some dodgy people attending there and unfortunately someone saw this as an opportunity to acquire an iphone and an ipad.

You can put your complaint in writing to the insurer and if not satisfied with the outcome maybe try

http://financial-ombudsman.org.uk/default.htm

Loss or theft of ipads, iphones, laptops, etc will flag as a high risk of fraud to insurers and whilst I am in no way saying that this is the case with you, it's just the way that they look at it so you will need to push a bit harder for your claim.

There is no guarantee of success but there's no harm trying.

Good luck.

Olza23

SuePritchard wrote: »

Absolutely. And there is also, surely, a test of reasonableness and fairness in context. So if I'd put my bag down in the centre of pub and walked off, fair enough. But when I put my bag down in the restaurant of a private, secure, business school where I work, within my line of sight and my colleagues....? The point is, I don't know when or how it was stolen, but that the insurers were clearly only interested in looking for a point in my narrative when they could decline cover.

Did you do all these things when the theft was taking place?

Remember you are under there terms and conditions and they are a business afterall. Should they pay out? Yes

Will they? Probably not, business and morales don't mix..

I hope it works out for you.

Faith177

SuePritchard wrote: »

Absolutely. And there is also, surely, a test of reasonableness and fairness in context. So if I'd put my bag down in the centre of pub and walked off, fair enough. But when I put my bag down in the restaurant of a private, secure, business school where I work, within my line of sight and my colleagues....? The point is, I don't know when or how it was stolen, but that the insurers were clearly only interested in looking for a point in my narrative when they could decline cover.

If it was in your sight how did it go missing without you knowing what happened.

Axa policy books states under what is not covered on personal possession (pg14 of policy book)

f) to items not in the care, custody or control of

you, or your family.

Your items weren't in your care, custody or control as you had walked away from them therefore no cover.

I'm really sorry your things were taken but you are a little to blame for that

SuePritchard

I understand your literal interpretation but FSO also requires that insurers can't get out of their responsibilities like this and requires them to apply a test of reasonableness and fairness. It can't be reasonable to assume that everyone at all times has their hand on all their personal possessions covered under the policy or we'd all be walking around like little pack horses.. They do have a right to expect that we all act responsibly with regard to our possessions in context. Since there had been no thefts at all at Ashridge for 7 years, I think my actions were reasonable, appropriate and proportionate. I am sure many more thefts occur in crowded places: will insurers decline to cover pickpocketed fans at a footy match because they 'must have been unaware of their pockets' for the theft to occur...? Do they decline to cover people who's handbags are under the table in a pub...? Without getting all Philosophy 101, applying the rules like this might be logical but it isn't reasonable. "You have to be in control of your possessions of all time, your things were stolen, ergo you weren't in control of them, therefore you're not covered..." Why insure at all if insurers have this route out? You have to take all reasonable steps to be in control at all times... It's different...

forgotmyname

If you had £500 in cash would you stick it on the table and pop off to the loo?

Most people would not, But people do this with phones worth that much daily.

Yes a handbag under the table could be classed as not in your posession.

jonesMUFCforever

...........But OP does not want to hear this - she wants someone to agree with her.

TSx

To be sure

Was anyone else left at your table?
Was anyone else eating with you?
Could you have asked a colleague to look after the bag?
How far away was the buffet?
How long were you gone?

The FOS viewpoint would be that providing the policyholder had exercised reasonable care, they would require the insurer to cover it. What is reasonable depends on the precautions that possibly could have been taken.