Boiler repair ripoffs

[Deleted User]

British Gas has a nice advert about looking after us and a £79 offer which sounds just wonderful - not! That's for half an hour - anything more than that and the price might shoot up to £250 for whatever. Or I can take out a £20 a month policy and get the whatever job done for £100 or so (she's got me trapped you see - too late for £11 a month).

Boilers used to last years and years - especially cast iron back boilers. Now they might last a year or so. Seems to be luck. No boiler should be sold with a guarantee of less than 5 years because the costs of repair are a ripoff. The cost of parts is absurd. £250 for a 3 way valve! £70 for a Diverter Valve "motor" top. If you look at the things they must be worth maybe £50 and £20 respectively, if that. These are simple things - bits of pipe, some wires and a little motor. When you think of the value you can get for £250 in say a phone or a camera, there is no justification for the price - except they can get away with it. I wouldn't be surprised if it was another industry wide scam to keep prices absurdly high so they can all get a piece of our money.

My mother had an Ideal Logic Combi HE30 installed with the Staywarm scheme - good in principle. But they insist on installing that particular boiler with a 2 year guarantee. 1 year later - heat exchanger went. Now no hot water - just out of guarantee. You would think a government funded scheme would insist of the best value for money which would be at least a 5 year guarantee.

And why do even local "heating engineers" and plumbers think they deserve at least a £50 call out charge before you start paying for the rest? When did I last get paid £50 an hour? They charge it cos they can.

Some tips to save money:

• Know your own boiler - read the manuals and forums for tips and hints. At least then you can then talk to the engineer on more equal terms and have an idea of what is probably the fault.
• Get the problem diagnosed and then check the online part price which can be half the price of a local supplier even with the plumbers discount. It's like getting stuff done on the car - supply your own parts and save a fortune.
• A qualified local engineer is sure to be cheaper than any of these service companies.

I had the part replaced for £100 instead of £250! But if I had seen how easy it was to do I could have done it myself for £50 (the price of the part). I know not all jobs are so easy but if I were working for £50 an hour I would be a happy bunny!

fishybusiness

And why do even local "heating engineers" and plumbers think they deserve at least a £50 call out charge before you start paying for the rest? When did I last get paid £50 an hour? They charge it cos they can.

Often it is not about 'deserving', any tradesperson visiting premises has to juggle jobs, especially small jobs, and visits for estimates. Their hourly rate is exactly zero whilst travelling, and estimating, and all of that is part of their working day.

All they need is two callouts in one day with quick fixes, and be paid their lowly, say £20 per hour plus parts.....don't they?

They have bills, insurance, travelling costs, vehicle costs, tooling, advertising, phone costs, it just goes on.

I don't like paying extra charges, but I would prefer to pay a professional to sort my boiler, who is happy to come to work, and will help me out when I need it.

ollski

Bit of a strange post. Bg have 3 tiers of on demand pricing, it starts at 79 which is basically a diagnostic and up to 30 mins of work if it needs no parts. If it's going to take longer the engineer will tell you and you can decide to proceed or not.I think the next price band is about 180 including 12 month guarantee on parts and labour.

If the parts are so simple why not make them yourself?

Not sure what you do but if you are unhappy with your salary why not do something else?, it's supply, demand and skills which determine others labour costs, not your salary and table of worthiness.

Most guys charge a call out to make a living otherwise plenty of tightwads would be expecting a free diagnosis so they can source the parts off the net and have a go themselves!

McKneff

I just signed up for BG a couple of months ago for £11 a month, they came to do an initial service, spot on timing, It would cost me £120 for a service from someone local so to have the extra protection for breakdown from BG is worth it for the peace of mind. I have a warm air heating system.

Ive nothing but praise from my point of view.

C_Mababejive

Speaking as one who has been in the industry for over 30 years i can say that the whole business of central heating,gas and boilers is fiercely competitive. There is a shortage of highly skilled real engineers and too many people just winging it for a living. Parts for modern boilers are very expensive even at trade prices. Engineers have to keep spending more money on equipment,diagnostics,training etc to keep up to speed. The answer is simple. Dont buy a combi. Keep with traditional storage systems and system HE boilers if you must.

ihateyes

[Deleted User] wrote:

British Gas has a nice advert about looking after us and a £79 offer which sounds just wonderful - not! That's for half an hour - anything more than that and the price might shoot up to £250 for whatever. Or I can take out a £20 a month policy and get the whatever job done for £100 or so (she's got me trapped you see - too late for £11 a month).

Boilers used to last years and years - especially cast iron back boilers. Now they might last a year or so. Seems to be luck. No boiler should be sold with a guarantee of less than 5 years because the costs of repair are a ripoff. The cost of parts is absurd. £250 for a 3 way valve! £70 for a Diverter Valve "motor" top. If you look at the things they must be worth maybe £50 and £20 respectively, if that. These are simple things - bits of pipe, some wires and a little motor. When you think of the value you can get for £250 in say a phone or a camera, there is no justification for the price - except they can get away with it. I wouldn't be surprised if it was another industry wide scam to keep prices absurdly high so they can all get a piece of our money.

My mother had an Ideal Logic Combi HE30 installed with the Staywarm scheme - good in principle. But they insist on installing that particular boiler with a 2 year guarantee. 1 year later - heat exchanger went. Now no hot water - just out of guarantee. You would think a government funded scheme would insist of the best value for money which would be at least a 5 year guarantee.

And why do even local "heating engineers" and plumbers think they deserve at least a £50 call out charge before you start paying for the rest? When did I last get paid £50 an hour? They charge it cos they can.

Some tips to save money:

• Know your own boiler - read the manuals and forums for tips and hints. At least then you can then talk to the engineer on more equal terms and have an idea of what is probably the fault.
• Get the problem diagnosed and then check the online part price which can be half the price of a local supplier even with the plumbers discount. It's like getting stuff done on the car - supply your own parts and save a fortune.
• A qualified local engineer is sure to be cheaper than any of these service companies.

I had the part replaced for £100 instead of £250! But if I had seen how easy it was to do I could have done it myself for £50 (the price of the part). I know not all jobs are so easy but if I were working for £50 an hour I would be a happy bunny!

Well you know what to do dont you??

Train to be a Gas Engineer.

C_Mababejive

#6 No..dont! There are already too many people thinking they will get rich being a Gas Engineer/Plumber/Electrician?MCSE Certified blah blah blah....

ihateyes

C_Mababejive wrote: »

#6 No..dont! There are already too many people thinking they will get rich being a Gas Engineer/Plumber/Electrician?MCSE Certified blah blah blah....

very true:rotfl:

[Deleted User]

Seems some people are happy to pay ridiculous prices for whatever. Just because a thing is what it is doesn't mean it is right. Like all fuel prices. Are they OK too? How high do prices have to go before the British think it is enough? Doesn't anybody read the news? These big companies are making a fortune out of us - BG one of them. People can't afford to heat their homes or pay for boiler repairs. My mother on her pension certainly cannot.

£20 an hour "lowly". that's at least half the working population who get less than that. I wish I could find somebody to fix the roof for that. A tradesman typically does charge for his traveling time, which I think is fair enough actually, it's just the cost of it I don't think is always justified. Has anybody worked out how much £40-£50 an hour is on a yearly basis? 3 days work would be fine for me at that rate. Graduates after paying all that money to study and 3 years or more study don't get anywhere near that rate, most of them.

I do not think £150 to £200 for a simple repair is fair. I do not think £79 just to spend half an hour checking a boiler is fair. (£79 for half an hour's work! I wish...nice money if you can get it) At that rate all would have to do is work 2 or 3 hours and I'd be over the moon. I am forced to pay it because heat and hot water is as necessary as food. and when we have a need suppliers will exploit it. That's what supply and demand is - exploitation of the weakest. I prefer a world of fairness.

Anybody watched Rogue Trader? The idea that if you pay a lot you will get the best work doesn't stand up. Only experience will get you good work done.

I think I get better value from my car mechanic. In comparison to boiler parts, car parts are cheap. I use the same garages and get good work done at a fair price - especially if I buy my own parts (tradesman's nightmare I know!).

The spare part prices are over the top. So someone somewhere is keeping them high. Price for price compared to other goods they are not worth the price we have to pay. I dismantled the diverter motor. Sorry, not worth the £70 I had to pay, either in construction or component terms. True price should be about £10 or £20.

And the main point of course is that our wages (most of us) and pensions are not enough to cover such costs. Anyone noticed that shops are closing down, sales are on early - why? Because these basic bills are so big nowadays we don't have enough surplus cash to go on shopping sprees.

I think at school children should get careers advice based on what their hourly rate might be when they start a job. You wouldn't do nursing or teaching or be a policeman. Everything right now in the UK is back to front and working against the generality of people. Prices and costs are right out of control. That's why we are in such a financial mess. I say "we" but we didn't cause it of course.

And finally, if I could just say to my boss when I have one, I'd like say £30 an hour please and he would say yes of course, Merry Christmas. Some people her must be high earners. That's good, if you can get it.

MillicentBystander

Some gas engineers seem to be ignoring the law of supply and demand. There are basically way too many gas safe regd plumbers than there are jobs available so the supply is more than the demand no matter how some try and spin it. If you don't believe me, simply go to the Gas Safe site, input your post code and see how many reg'd engineers there are within just a 5 mile radius. The bloke who put the boiler in my house is a superb plumber but work is so scarce he has had to sub contract for a Big 6 company working all over the country. unless you have a recommended plumber just get a quote from approx 5 of the plumbers and, importantly, TELL THEM WHAT YOU ARE DOING. You should get a very decent quote.

fishybusiness

When you look at the hourly rate of a tradesman, if he is onsite all day, his rate looks good, and he is paid well for his day.

I do think that when tradespeople are repairing, and moving from job to job in a day things are different, they do need a days wages, and have to find a way to bring it in, otherwise they cannot earn a living wage.

So £20 per hour is enough is onsite all day, not enough if picking up 3 x 1 hour jobs in different locations.

There are basically way too many gas safe regd plumbers than there are jobs available so the supply is more than the demand no matter how some try and spin it.

Interesting point. I would have thought that the more qualified engineers in any locality, the more competition, and the lower their ability to charge a high rate.

Yet still the rates are at the higher end, I don't understand.