3 Month Rolling Contract- Still Rolling 18mths Later

LadySarah

Please can someone offer me some sound advice.
I work for a very large company, I have been employed by them since Aug 2009.
I moved to the other side of the country in July 2011 due to personal reasons and handed in my notice which was accept. Then a few days before I moved the CEO of the company offered me a 'new' position for the same company (more or less doing the same job) but working from a local office, of a branch of a company under the same umbrella.

The terms of this contract are a 3 month rolling contract.... July 2011 to now. How much longer can they keep rolling this for. I wish I had my old permanent contract.
I lost my holiday entitlement which I had built up.
I now get 1.6 days for every month worked- I previously had 24days + bank holidays.
This is a Monday - Friday 9-5 job. I stayed on the same salary.
Please can someone shed some light on this for me, not having the security is awful.

Oh and because out HR dept aren't the greatest (my opinion) I haven't actually signed a contract since April.... they posted 3 contracts to back sign and 1 to take me up until 25th Jan 2013 a few days ago.

I belong to a union but I am still awaiting advice from them....

SarEl

I think you are confused - whatever new contract you may or may not get, they don't have to give you more holidays! They only have to give you a minimum of what the law says (28 days including public holidays). Try this for an answer to all your other questions http://www.redundancyforum.co.uk/frequently-asked-questions/6325-permanent-not-contracts-explained/

KiKi

LadySarah wrote: »

The terms of this contract are a 3 month rolling contract.... July 2011 to now. How much longer can they keep rolling this for. I wish I had my old permanent contract.

So you are effectively on a series of fixed term contracts which are renewed every three months? This shouldn't happen for longer than four years, in law - although AFAIUI (perhaps SarEl can clarify) strictly speaking your right (after four years) is to request a permanent contract, but they could refuse if they have a reasonable business reason for it.

HOWEVER. Although you must feel quite insecure, please be aware that as you have worked there longer than a year - and were employed before 06 April this year - you have exactly the same rights as a permanent employee. They can't just let you go. If they want to end your contract, it's now a redundancy situation, and you would be treated as any permanent member of staff facing redundancy.

I lost my holiday entitlement which I had built up.

Assuming you had no break of service, you lose nothing. You are entitled to the same as a permanent member of staff there. The legal minimum is 28 days PAID LEAVE a year, which can include Bank Holidays. If permanent staff get more, you're entitled to the same.

Oh and because out HR dept aren't the greatest (my opinion) I haven't actually signed a contract since April.... they posted 3 contracts to back sign and 1 to take me up until 25th Jan 2013 a few days ago.

Don't worry so much about the signed contract - the fact you work there and the fact they pay you is enough to determine that a contract exists. However, the end date is more the concern, and you should get in writing from them (in an email if nothing else) when the end date for your current contract is.

But once again - you have been there for over a year. So if they end your contract, you have the same rights a a permanent member of staff whose contract is ending. So the security isn't as bad as you probably think!

HTH - please ask if you have further questions.

p.s. All the above assumes that when you renew your contract you have no breaks of service.

SarEl

KiKi wrote: »

If permanent staff get more, you're entitled to the same.
.

Covered most of this in the link I posted, but.... ermm, Kiki... are you sure about this huge assumption?? (a) the OP said she used to previously get more - not that staff in this job get more if they are permanant and (b) how do you know on what basis the OP is getting less holiday, if she is - there's nothing per se unlawful in giving one member of staff more holidays than another, or less. They would have to show that the basis for this was unlawful.

agrinnall

Do you get paid for bank holidays in addition to the 1.6 days per month that you accrue? If so then that works out just about at the statutory minimum (actually slightly below, 19.2 days rather than the 20 you should have, but perhaps the accrual is really 1.666... days, which would give you 20 per year). I suspect you won't be able to force the company to reinstate your previous entitlement, the time to take this up would have been before you accepted the first contract.

LadySarah

SarEl wrote: »

I think you are confused - whatever new contract you may or may not get, they don't have to give you more holidays! They only have to give you a minimum of what the law says (28 days including public holidays).

I understand that... but 1.6 days x 12 months is 19.2 days- actually under the legal requirement- 1.6 days per month is what is stated on my contract.
I fully understand the legally i am entitled to 28days incl bank holidays

SarEl

But do you get bank / public holidays as well?

LadySarah

KiKi wrote: »

So you are effectively on a series of fixed term contracts which are renewed every three months? This shouldn't happen for longer than four years, in law - although AFAIUI (perhaps SarEl can clarify) strictly speaking your right (after four years) is to request a permanent contract, but they could refuse if they have a reasonable business reason for it.

HOWEVER. Although you must feel quite insecure, please be aware that as you have worked there longer than a year - and were employed before 06 April this year - you have exactly the same rights as a permanent employee. They can't just let you go. If they want to end your contract, it's now a redundancy situation, and you would be treated as any permanent member of staff facing redundancy.

Assuming you had no break of service, you lose nothing. You are entitled to the same as a permanent member of staff there. The legal minimum is 28 days PAID LEAVE a year, which can include Bank Holidays. If permanent staff get more, you're entitled to the same.


Don't worry so much about the signed contract - the fact you work there and the fact they pay you is enough to determine that a contract exists. However, the end date is more the concern, and you should get in writing from them (in an email if nothing else) when the end date for your current contract is.

But once again - you have been there for over a year. So if they end your contract, you have the same rights a a permanent member of staff whose contract is ending. So the security isn't as bad as you probably think!

HTH - please ask if you have further questions.

p.s. All the above assumes that when you renew your contract you have no breaks of service.

Amazing advice thank you.

Wow 4 years!! thats scary!

While i have been on the 3 month rolling contract since July 2011, i have had no breaks in it.
We both have to give each other 1 month notice when leaving- another term in the contract.

The issue i have concerning security is that they can give me 1 months notice to leave. Yet the rest of my team i belong to (my old team) would need to be made redundant (Highly unlikely to happen) or go down the disciplinary route if they wished to get rid of a member of staff.

I want to ask for a permanent contract, without risk of peeing off my manager who controls whether i stay of go.

LadySarah

SarEl wrote: »

But do you get bank / public holidays as well?

Yes- which totals 27days... i am 1 day short this year and owed 1 from last year in theory!

LadySarah

SarEl wrote: »

Covered most of this in the link I posted, but.... ermm, Kiki... are you sure about this huge assumption?? (a) the OP said she used to previously get more - not that staff in this job get more if they are permanant and (b) how do you know on what basis the OP is getting less holiday, if she is - there's nothing per se unlawful in giving one member of staff more holidays than another, or less. They would have to show that the basis for this was unlawful.

A- your entitlement increases each year worked. Newbies start on 20 + bank holidays.
B- looks like 1 day less for moi.

When i started in Aug 2009 i started on 21days + bank holidays- i left when i was entitled to 23days + bank Holidays.

SarEl

LadySarah wrote: »

Yes- which totals 27days... i am 1 day short this year and owed 1 from last year in theory!

No - you aren't. You got 9 days public hoidays last year and 9 days this year - which makes 28.2 days holiday in each year? And besides which, if you only got 8 days (.8 days under then) then you had to raise this with the employer last year. And if they are not giving you 28 days this year then you must raise it with them.