National Insurance Credits

mleonard79

Hi Everyone,

I've done part-time work for several years for which I'm registered self-employed and have had an exemption certificate as regards NI Contributions due to low earnings but was unaware that this meant I wasn't getting any NI contributions credited or I would have just paid the £2 p/w at the time. Unfortunately since then I have become unable to work due to ill health although I still do a very small amount of self-employed work when I feel up to it.

Over the last year or so I've had several bills in from the Inland Revenue demanding money for NI Contributions (what they're asking for probably comes to over half what I've earned all this year!) They told me to just get another exemption certificate but I'm worried about this as it woud mean even more years going by without my having any NI Contributions. Anyway I phoned Jobcentre Plus for their advice and they said that I could apply for NI Contibutions Credits through Jobseekers Allowance without actually taking or getting the Jobseekers Allowance itself (ie just the NI credits.) This sounds ok for me but they have said I will have to go to a meeting at the Jobcentre (some kind of work assessment I think) so I'm a bit worried about this and was wondering if anyone knew exactly what it entails - will I still be allowed to get the credits even although I'll be saying to them I'm not fit to work? The person I spoke to on the phone said I should be able to but seemed unsure. Also can the credits be backdated at all? I'm just sick to death of these bills I keep getting but at the same time am a little worried about my pension forecast situation too since I have 0 qualifying years. Thanks for any help.

Regards

Michelle

ukdickie31

Hi

Are you claiming Income Support / Incapacity benefit as you state that you are unfit for work ? If that's the case then make sure you have a doctor's note to hand in with your claim forms.

If you are claiming JSA, you must be able to work, willing to work and actively seeking work in order to make a claim.

Claiming the benefits above does depend on your NI contributions so I assume you haven't paid enough (hence the letters from HMRC). You will then be looking at means tested benefits (JSA or Income Support) so you will have to declare the income of yourself and any partner, as well as any savings and capital.

Regardless of which benefit you have claimed, the Interview that you wll be attending will be a "work focused Interview." This means you will have to be informed of the ways to find work and options explored to support you back to work.

If you are not entitled to any benefit, you may continue with the claim for NI stamps purposes as long as you satisfy the underlying qualifying conditions for the benefit you are claiming.

I doubt whether the claim would be backdated from what you have said. Ignorance is not in itself a reson to allow backdating.

Now, back to those NI letters.

You may have received what's called a deficiency notice saying that some NI contributions are required in order to make the tax year count towards your pension. If that's the case, then these are notifications for information, rather than demands for payment.

To get full pension a man used to have to have 44 full years of NI conts and a woman 39 years. This may change in the future. This was further complicated by people worrying about the value of the state pension in years to come and with Pension Credit and other safeguards introduced, many have questioned the value of actually paying into something that you will get a means tested 'safety net' for anyway.

You really need to look at the whole picture rather than a few letters in isolation. Depending on your age, why not ask for a Pension Forecast and see whether what you need to pay to get the years to count towards your pension is actually worth the weekly increase in your pension.

mleonard79

Hi ukdickie31,

Thanks very much for your detailed reply.

Are you claiming Income Support / Incapacity benefit as you state that you are unfit for work ?

No I've never claimed any benefits - the way I understand it there really isn't anything I could claim that suits. As I'm not fit to work shifts I can't claim JSA as I know you have to be actively seeking work to get that. I'm apparently not eligible for income support due to my savings and although I'm seemingly eligible for incapacity benefit I don't want to claim that as it would mean I would have to give up doing even the small amount of self-employed work that I am able to do at the moment. I know some people will think it's silly to not claim that when I can get more money by doing so but I really prefer to be able to do whatever small amount of work that I can on principle even if it means less money overall - I do think it's crazy though that just because I can do some things I would have to give them up in order to get any help. You would think they would want to encourage people to do whatever they can to support themselves Then again I guess if I hadn't looked after my money by saving so well and spent it all prior to becoming ill I would be able to claim a good few benefits but since I took care of my finances and wanted to support myself that seems to go against me. Anyway that's a whole other argument!! All I really want is to get the NI situation sorted out.

the Interview that you wll be attending will be a "work focused Interview." This means you will have to be informed of the ways to find work and options explored to support you back to work.

That sounds quite difficult then - there really isn't any way for me to know how and when I will be fit to work properly again. All I can really tell them is that I'm not at the moment.

I doubt whether the claim would be backdated from what you have said. Ignorance is not in itself a reson to allow backdating.

Fair enough I should have looked at it more thoroughly at the time - I was given bad advice as well though but I'm happy to accept blame for not reading the small print, it would be good to get it from here on though.

You may have received what's called a deficiency notice saying that some NI contributions are required in order to make the tax year count towards your pension. If that's the case, then these are notifications for information, rather than demands for payment.

No the letters I have been receiving are definitely demands for payment - they are bills. This latest one is for £109.20 saying I owe this in arrears and that payment must be made in no later than 28 days. It's just frustrating as I've had several of these in the last year despite the fact each time I get them I phone them up and tell them I'm not earning much and they say just to disregard the bill. According to the latest person I spoke to though the others shouldn't have said this. :mad: She's told me to write a letter explaining the situation and ask them to strike this bill from my records so I'm going to do that.

Depending on your age, why not ask for a Pension Forecast and see whether what you need to pay to get the years to count towards your pension is actually worth the weekly increase in your pension.

I'm 28 so I know I've got a long time to go until I really need to worry about this but I've already done my pension forecast and I genuinely have 0 qualifying years. This is mainly due to several more years being ill when I was younger, 4 years at uni and quite a lot of time spent abroad inbetween. So it's annoying that in the few years I was able to work I didn't make enough contributions to earn a qualifying year yet I could have if I had been paying the class 2 contributions as opposed to having the exemption certificate they recommended I get! I wouldn't have minded paying it at that time but I do now when I'm earning so little. Like you say though it may make very little difference in the long run with all the changes being made to pensions and I'm also reluctant to throw any money at it while it's in such a state of flux.

Anyway it will be interesting to see what they say to me at this meeting - the person I spoke to on the phone was sure I would be eligible for the NI credits so I hope she was right. Thanks for your help.

Regards

Michelle

mleonard79

Well I just thought I'd update this and have a good rant at the sheer incompetance on display!!! :mad: It seems I was right to be dubious about that interview and the advice I'd been given as when the letter about the interview and the claim form came through the door this morning the very first stipulation on the front of the application that I saw was:

To get NI credits for any period you must have been:

available for work, willing to work, capable of work and actively seeking work

Well I clearly don't fit that bill so I've just been given duff advice and wasted a load of time on the phone being given it! :mad: Anyway I phoned up the local JobcentrePlus the interview was arranged for and explained the saga to them. They confirmed I wasn't eligible for the credits, apologised for my being given the wrong information, cancelled the interview and got a benefits specialist to phone me. She talked with me for a while and confirmed, as I already knew, that there really isn't anything that fits my circumstances and I'm in a catch 22 situation so there's nothing they can do to get my NI contributions credited. She told me to phone the Inland Revenue back up and see if they could do something. So I did that and got the same spiel off them that they couldn't do anything and I should talk to JobcentrePlus! :rotfl:

So it seems I'm back to square one and will just have to fill out another exemption certificate and carry on having 0 qualifying years. My only other option is to pay it but I don't want to throw my money at that when I might need it. So frustrating!!

Regards

Michelle

Becles

Class 2 National Insurance is only £2.20 a week.

It's worth paying in case your circumstances change, as it will entitle you to benefits should you need them. In my case, I'll be able to claim £112.85 a week MA for 39 weeks while I'm off work with my baby.

mleonard79

Becles wrote: »

Class 2 National Insurance is only £2.20 a week.

It's worth paying in case your circumstances change, as it will entitle you to benefits should you need them. In my case, I'll be able to claim £112.85 a week MA for 39 weeks while I'm off work with my baby.

Hi Becles,

Thanks for your reply - I know it's only £2.20 a week and I agree it was worth paying when I was working more and I would have done had I realised it would have given me qualifying years but now that I do so little I feel it's not very fair for me to have to pay over £100 a year to them. As far as being able to claim benefits in the future goes as my situation seems to not fit into any of their benefits at the moment I'm a bit disillusioned about that aspect of it - it's great that you're going to get so much from them when you're off having your baby and I don't begrudge you or anyone else that in the slightest but it just seems like only people who have children or are completely disabled or incapacitated can get helped. I think I'll just need to get the exemption certificate and then if I ever get fit enough to work and earn properly again I may backpay a few years but I just find it pretty frustrating all in.

Regards

Michelle

ukdickie31

Hi again

Sorry that you had a waste of time. I'd really explore the option of income support / incapacity benefit. There is a lot more support in this area and you may find a sympathetic doctor who will give you a sick note.

If that happens, claim IS / Incap.

You may get time with a Job broker and all sorts of support to get a job that you can manage.

mleonard79

Hi ukdickie31,

Ive already talked to several people at the benefits/jobcentreplus office about income support/incapacity benefit and I'm not eligible for the first due to savings and can only get the second if I give up absolutely everything which I don't want to do under any circumstances. There doesn't seem to be any inbetween thing they can offer me even if it was just to get my NI credits and not any benefits. They have said that I could go back to doing a very small amount of permitted self-employed work after being on incapacity for a few months but the way my self-employed work is I can't quantify it in terms of hours and wouldn't want to be restricted to only being able to earn £20 every week even although a lot of weeks I don't earn even that. Plus if I gave it up for several months I would lose out on jobs that I regularly get asked to do as they would simply be offered to other people. Also I wouldn't want to spend my time worrying if I'd contravened the rules in any way - it's not worth the hassle.

As far as a sypathetic doctor goes my doctor is sypathetic and would give me any sick notes if I asked for them - she's offered them in the past. I've just not needed them as I didn't have an employer to give them to since I was working freelance when I took unwell again.

I'm not sure a job broker would do me any good as there isn't any proper jobs out there I could manage as things stand at the moment. I can't do shiftwork of any kind - the only reason I can do the self-employed stuff on occasion is that I am given several weeks in which to do them and I can choose whatever day or time within that alloted time myself so I just go and do them when I feel up to it. That's not exactly possible with a job :rotfl: It'd be great if you could say to an employer I'll just come in when I feel up to it but I can't tell you when that's going to be as I won't know til it happens and I could take unwell quickly again so I can't tell you how long I'l be able to stay!! I'm sure they'd be queueing up

It's just very frustrating that I seem to be out of the loop but I guess that's just the way it is :mad: Thanks for your help.

Regards

Michelle