can I stop my children being taken abroad

Woven1

Things have reached all time low in my relationship. My partner is Portuguese and we have a son aged 10 months and another on the way. We live in a city that neither of us originally come from and we both feel terribly isolated. Things have came to a head this week and she has told me she is moving back to Portugal. I have no idea wot to do. I have a 15 year old child from a previous relationship and it will break his heart when he hears this. Me going out there is not an option. My 10 month old is sleeping by my side as I write this. I just don't know what to do. If I take the legal route eventually she will win (she is a good mum) but then she'll hate me. If I do nothing then it's as if I've given up. I've never posted anything before & even now I don't see a solution or how this will help.

DS4215

You can fight it legally but you will need to consult a specialist lawyer and it could be expensive (and she will probably win in the end as she wants to move back to her home). Making her stay in this country will make her resentful and could cause problems with access for years to come - imagine how bad you will feel if they are just down the road but you cannot see them because she is messing you about and cancelling access at the last moment....

If you are still talking then try to discuss this as adults to come to a suitable arrangement. Perhaps you could visit your children for holidays several times a year (flights can be cheap if booked in advance). Once they are older you can always use Skype/Facetime or similar to talk to them on a regular basis.

If you contact Families Need Fathers they should be able to give you more advice on this.

FattyBettyBoo

Hi, didn't want to read and run, so just wanted to say I really feel for you.

The world is a smaller place nowadays and finances permitting, Portugal isn't the other side of the planet.

*Robin*

Woven1 wrote: »

Things have reached all time low in my relationship. My partner is Portuguese and we have a son aged 10 months and another on the way. We live in a city that neither of us originally come from and we both feel terribly isolated. Things have came to a head this week and she has told me she is moving back to Portugal. I have no idea wot to do. I have a 15 year old child from a previous relationship and it will break his heart when he hears this. Me going out there is not an option. My 10 month old is sleeping by my side as I write this. I just don't know what to do. If I take the legal route eventually she will win (she is a good mum) but then she'll hate me. If I do nothing then it's as if I've given up. I've never posted anything before & even now I don't see a solution or how this will help.

Woven, it sounds like you are in shock. But you can make this work if you approach the problem from another angle; in fact I can see a few positives.

Because your wife is Portuguese she will have grown up with a level of family support that most folk in the UK can barely comprehend. She is pregnant and trying to cope with a baby - so of course she is feeling miserable and isolated, so far away from her family. Presumably you're working as you say you could not relocate, so you're probably not able to help her as much as you'd like to. Add in the miserable UK weather at this time of year, and it's hardly surprising that your wife wants to go home.
Your OP does not suggest you and she have actual problems in your relationship - the rest of my comments assume that.

At the moment employment prospects right across southern Europe are pretty dire; there are many wives and families living with grand-parents while Dad works in another country. It is normal, and ok, for Dads to fly 'home' with one of the cheap airlines every month or so and spend a weekend with their family. It's not ideal, but it's doable, at least for a while. It's a lot better than being long-term unemployed.

From your point of view, Woven, you would be able to live much more economically in the UK, and if you'll be supporting your wife and child in Portugal [hope so!] their house-keeping bill will be much lower.
You'll become an expert on booking tickets three months in advance to get the best prices (can be ridiculously cheap if you keep some clothes 'at home' in Portugal so don't need to book a hold bag).
You might consider buying a banger and renting a garage close to the airport the cheap airline flies to, to minimise transit time and hire-car costs.
You and your older child would have regular short adventures - assume you'd take him with you? - great bonding opportunity for the NRP and fun for him!

There's not much doubt that children have a better time in southern European societies than they do in the UK. The lifestyle and diet are healthier. All three children will pick up the language - admittedly Portuguese isn't one of the World's major languages and most people there [under the age of 50] speak good English, but your children will 'get' the multi-lingual attitude which UK kids rarely have - and that will be a very useful talent to have in the future when these children are going out into their adult lives.

There are challenges to be met in maintaining a successful long-distance relationship with one's spouse. Trust and a mature attitude are essential.
These days skype/facetalk make it very easy for the absent parent to share a chat with their wife and child[ren] every day, which helps.
During reunions there's always plenty to say and a happy atmosphere because it is precious time together. There is no room for argument or getting bored and upset by the mundane factors of life.
In your case, OP, you and your older son also have the wonderful experience of being welcomed into your wife's family - I cannot recommend that highly enough (but sorry don't have time to explain all the advantages, especially for your older son, atm).

With a positive attitude you could make this arrangement part of your lives, Woven - if you want to keep your family 'together' despite the fact that for most of the time you must be physically separated. Even if it lasted a year or so before your lives move on and you can all be together full-time again - isn't it worth putting some effort into your family now?
Think outside the box; it really can be fun being adventurous and unconventional, and lead on to some surprisingly good experiences.

Tim_Bisley

First off, please get some legal advice as you need to hear from an expert. Most solicitors will give you an initial 30 minute consultancy for free.

FWIW I've been poring over lots of ex-pat forums for a while now as we are moving abroad. I've seen this come up a lot, and as far as I know you have to give express permission to allow any children to leave. See this extract from a family law website:

Where one parent, who is the primary carer, wishes to permanently remove the children, written consent is required from the other parent. If consent is refused the move abroad with the children cannot take place unless permission is obtained from the court.

A parent, who removes the child from the country without obtaining such permission, has ‘wrongfully removed’ the child, even if the child normally lives with them.

In answer to your title, yes you can, but it seems like it could be a battle. Good luck with whatever you decide.

missindecisive

WOVEN, the one thing that struck me when I read your post was that you have a 10 month baby and another one on the way. Your wife has barely had time to recover from the birth of your child and is pregant again...she will be totally exhausted, I know, ive been there. SO, aswell as looking after a small child, with all the sleepless nights and adjustments to make, she is probably feeling sick, tired, and perhaps a little down. She may be feeling isolated with no other females to talk to. ?

Is there no way on this earth that you can salvage this relationship? Can you talk through your problems and find a soloution, other than separating?

Your wife should be intouch with the local health visitor who will be able to provide her with info on local toddler groups, where there will be other mums to provide support, all of whom are in the same situation with very young children. Its amazing how much difference it makes for a mum to get out of the house, have a hot drink and a natter, away from the household chores somewhere safe for the little one to play.

When I was in your wife's situation I was overwhelmed at being pregnant again so quickly and it got me quite down until I had time to get used to the idea. Could this be the same for your wife? It sounds like you both have a lot to cope with at the moment. See if you can talk to her....good luck.

daska

As with the other posters, I get a sense from your post that you believe this is the result of external factors rather than a fundamental problem with your relationship. If this is the case then there's no need for it to be the end of anything, just a different phase. If she and the children move back to Portugal then you could all see a benefit from it. More support will result in her being less tired, happier, a better mother as a result, and while I'm sure you will miss them like crazy you'll get some emotional satisfaction from knowing this. You can downsize as far as possible (or even move back with parents?) and use the money you save to make regular trips to see your family and still support them financially.

It can work, there are plenty of families within the UK who don't see each other from week to week due to family/work commitments, if anything for some it can be easier as the time you have together becomes that much more special.

Woven1

Things have calmed a little since I posted on here. I am trying to get my partner to agree to family counselling. Im also trying to get her to agree to moving to my home town where we will have a good support network. Early days yet. I love my family & will do whatever it takes. Thank you all for your advice it is really appreciated.

Mojisola

Woven1 wrote: »

Things have calmed a little since I posted on here. I am trying to get my partner to agree to family counselling. Im also trying to get her to agree to moving to my home town where we will have a good support network. Early days yet. I love my family & will do whatever it takes. Thank you all for your advice it is really appreciated.

I do hope you can work this out.

balletshoes

I hope you and your wife keep talking (and listening) and find a solution which works for you all.

Dunroamin

Why have you totally discounted moving the whole family to Portugal?