The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005

kingalew

I live with my partner in a part private / part council block. Around a month ago the social welfare residents all had their front entrance doors changed by the council. We are private tenants, we own the flat, and have today received a letter from London Borough of Redbridge Housing Services stating that we must, in order to comply with both secure by design standards (PAS24) and The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005, replace our front door at our cost. We have lived here for two years and have never had to pay anything like this before, other than the maintenance costs etc.

The letter states that we must meet current fire regulations (although PAS24 is a security measure to reduce the chance of being robbed, so unsure why we must meet this). Does anyone know anything about the aforementioned Fire Safety order and whether this kind of letter needs to be adhered to? Redbridge go on to recommend a preferred door contractor who will charge the princely sum of £700 (+VAT) to replace the door. All on a letter received a month before christmas (although we have until March 2013 to replace). We are able to select our own door installer if we prefer, so long as it meets their criteria (i.e. FD30S & PAS24).


Any help appreciated.

Thanks!

Lewis.

ColinHBH

Firstly I would contact London Borough of Redbridge through contact numbers displayed on their website and confirm whether this letter was sent by them. This certainly rings alarm bells of a scam!

Secondly if it is genuine request that they send you the relevant secure by design clauses relevant to this situation and fire safety regulations.

Thirdly, you can source a secure by design standard front door with FD30 fire rating for £400.00 a reputable joiner should be able to install for around £100.00. This would be a four to six hour operation dependant on the condition of the opening and what it is formed from for example brick, no fines aggregate etc.

anotherbaldrick

The Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005 covers nearly every type of building, structure and open space except for private homes and individual flats in a block or house, although communal areas will be affected.

So the question is , does your front door open onto a communal area ?

daveyjp

The new Fire Regs put the onus on the property owner to ensure the building meets current fire regs. If the door from a communal corridor into the flat is not a 30 minute fire door it fails and will need replacing.

Secure by design is not a pre requisite, but worth doing anyway.

roger196

It is unusual for regulations to have retrospective effect unless parliament specifically directs..... have you read through the regulations? It would be worth asking the local council why they consider retrospective effect applies...address your query to their legal department. Let us know the outcome. Also ask why it should not be at their cost as they want this doing.

anotherbaldrick

roger196 wrote: »

It is unusual for regulations to have retrospective effect unless parliament specifically directs..... have you read through the regulations? It would be worth asking the local council why they consider retrospective effect applies...address your query to their legal department. Let us know the outcome. Also ask why it should not be at their cost as they want this doing.

The reason should be obvious, The lack of adequate fire integrity in a dwellings front door onto a common area is not something that can be allowed to exist on the basis of historical existance. An identified life risk must be adressed. Who pays is a matter to be argued over, perhaps on the basis that the flats were sold with inadequate protection but don't let that delay the upgrade being done soonest.

daveyjp

roger196 wrote: »

It is unusual for regulations to have retrospective effect unless parliament specifically directs..... have you read through the regulations? It would be worth asking the local council why they consider retrospective effect applies...address your query to their legal department. Let us know the outcome. Also ask why it should not be at their cost as they want this doing.

Its not unusual in terms of fire regs. Previously the fire service undertook inspections advised what needed upgrading then issued fire certificates.

Now building owners are responsible retrospection is very common, especially with local authority owned properties The thought of a corporate manslaughter charge for a death due to failure to meet the regs is a wake up call.

Fire_Fox

Welcome! I am surprised they didn't consult, replace the door for you and charge you £700 plus VAT. The Borough is your superior landlord and they have a legal responsibility to the safety of both their shorthold and longhold tenants. Read your long lease carefully and do some research - most council/ housing association blocks provide for improvements not just repairs and maintenance as with private blocks. Some major works charges run to thousands and even tens of thousands of pounds per flat under Better Homes legislation so it is very wise to have some savings. http://www.lease-advice.org/publications/

roger196

Have a look at the booklet

Regulatory Reform (Fire Safety) Order 2005

"A short guide to making your premises safe from fire" issued by HM Govt and approved by the Chief Fire Officers Association.
On page 3 it states

Where does the order apply?

"It does not apply to:

• people’s private homes, including individual flats

in a block or house."

Happy reading.

missalex

I am also a Redbridge leaseholder and have had the same letter through. It would be interesting to know if you have got anywhere with the council on this one. I think the majority of leases state that it is the leaseholder who is responsible for the front door, but whether that extends to something that is a legal requirement for the freeholder to implement is not clear. We may have an argument if the regulations came into force prior to purchasing the property. I have a
feeling the council will not willingly replace all the leaseholder doors in addition to the council tenants, and are therefore trying to pass the cost on if they can get away with it.

vaio

I'd have thought as it's a fire safety thing you are obliged to comply.

Whether you have pay to have a door fitter come round and fit a new door or whether you pay the council to do it (via the service charge) should be covered in your lease.

As a landlord the council have a duty of care to their tenants & any else using the building and if that means upgrading all the doors giving access to an escape route then that what needs to happen.