Conergy solar panels

jimjames

k66 wrote: »

I am looking right now, it was a bit of a shock as the company are into encouring the use of renewable energy, I am making a complaint about the charges.

I'm not sure if it is still the case but when we got our FIT application in it was possible to get the FIT from someone other than your supplier.

We've just changed supplier again but our FIT is still with British Gas

Martyn1981

k66 wrote: »

Thanks Mart, I was asked to consider JaSolar by the same company, they would work out about £2000 cheaper and he said that they are very good.

Evening. How's that learning curve going?

Apologies for the cop out, but no views on panels, and it might take 10, 20 or more years before comparisons can be made. Which is a shame.

Did have fun (yes I am that sad) downloading various datasheets from the JASolar site:-

http://www.jasolar.com/webroot/products/modules.php

Always handy to swot up on what is possible, and I like the JAM6 72 range which are normal width (approx 1m) but 2m tall. Also the JAM5 range, which are normal height (approx 1.6m) but only 0.8m wide. Having slightly narrower, longer, shorter panels can help to maximise overall capacity.

For instance, due to a Velux, my main roof was an absolute perfect fit for 1m by 1.3m panels, whereas 1m by 1.6m would have looked odd and not filled it completely.

Of course not all panels are always available in all countries.

Right, back to the real world. Just an odd thought to complicate things now that you were just starting to relax. If you have a big roof, and aren't scared of spending a little more money, you could think about going bigger than 4kWp. The FIT for 4-10kWp installs is 10% less, but prices get cheaper as you go bigger, since scaffolding, paperwork etc don't go up, so it might work out.

Downside, you need permission from your district network operator (DNO) to export more than 3.68kW, so you'd have to check with them first. (Oh, and in case you spot it, that's why your quotes will probably involve inverters of 3.6kW, or 3.68kW or 3.68kW capped for a 4kWp system.)

As ideas go, probably worth dismissing out of hand, but shame on me if I'd not at least mentioned it, just in case.

Mart.

Edit: Sorry these posts are so long, not the intention, but they just kinda keep growing. M.

k66

jimjames wrote: »

I'm not sure if it is still the case but when we got our FIT application in it was possible to get the FIT from someone other than your supplier.

We've just changed supplier again but our FIT is still with British Gas

Thanks for your response. Good Energy looks pretty good to me as there are no charges, I've downloaded the documentation and their communications are very good. I will stick with LOCO2 as my provider.

k66

Martyn1981 wrote: »

Evening. How's that learning curve going?

Apologies for the cop out, but no views on panels, and it might take 10, 20 or more years before comparisons can be made. Which is a shame.

Did have fun (yes I am that sad) downloading various datasheets from the JASolar site:-

http://www.jasolar.com/webroot/products/modules.php

Always handy to swot up on what is possible, and I like the JAM6 72 range which are normal width (approx 1m) but 2m tall. Also the JAM5 range, which are normal height (approx 1.6m) but only 0.8m wide. Having slightly narrower, longer, shorter panels can help to maximise overall capacity.

For instance, due to a Velux, my main roof was an absolute perfect fit for 1m by 1.3m panels, whereas 1m by 1.6m would have looked odd and not filled it completely.

Of course not all panels are always available in all countries.

Right, back to the real world. Just an odd thought to complicate things now that you were just starting to relax. If you have a big roof, and aren't scared of spending a little more money, you could think about going bigger than 4kWp. The FIT for 4-10kWp installs is 10% less, but prices get cheaper as you go bigger, since scaffolding, paperwork etc don't go up, so it might work out.

Downside, you need permission from your district network operator (DNO) to export more than 3.68kW, so you'd have to check with them first. (Oh, and in case you spot it, that's why your quotes will probably involve inverters of 3.6kW, or 3.68kW or 3.68kW capped for a 4kWp system.)

As ideas go, probably worth dismissing out of hand, but shame on me if I'd not at least mentioned it, just in case.

Mart.

Edit: Sorry these posts are so long, not the intention, but they just kinda keep growing. M.

Hi Mart, it looks like we are heading for the Panasonic HIT, just a couple more quotes to come in. Thanks for your information. My learning curve is in a twist over inverters now, Fronius or Sunny Boy we want one to be as quiet as possible, I need to find out if they have a cooling fan, I don't want to be woken up at dawn to somethng clicking or whirring in the loft.
I think that I am getting to be an anorak now as I am discussing things like degradation and mounting systems.

jollyme

I use Good Energy for my Fit payments and a different company to purchase my electric. No problems with Good Energy. There is a delay of about 2-3months after submitting a reading before payment is received. This is not a problem and is reliable. AND they are a 'green' company

Martyn1981

k66 wrote: »

Hi Mart, it looks like we are heading for the Panasonic HIT, just a couple more quotes to come in. Thanks for your information. My learning curve is in a twist over inverters now, Fronius or Sunny Boy we want one to be as quiet as possible, I need to find out if they have a cooling fan, I don't want to be woken up at dawn to somethng clicking or whirring in the loft.
I think that I am getting to be an anorak now as I am discussing things like degradation and mounting systems.

Nearly there then - bet you thought this would be easy!

If you go to any of the inverter manufactures main UK websites you'll be able to choose products, then move to the 'grid-connected inverters' or 'grid-tied inverter' sections, such as:-

http://www.sma-uk.com/en_UK/products/solar-inverters.html

http://www.fronius.com/cps/rde/xchg/SID-C01A8855-DFF6CAC6/fronius_uk/hs.xsl/83_318.htm

from there, just wander aimlessly through the different models and read the tech sheets / data sheets / specifications. they'll all give decibel figures.

To be honest, at the ends of day, generation will be quite low, so unlikely to hear much whirring or buzzing. Just don't locate the inverter in your bedroom or living room.

The less efficient your inverter is, the more heat (and thus cooling) it'll produce, but for a large inverter (near 4kW) from one of the big names, efficiency should be 96% or more, so not so bad.

Since you said you want to buy quality, keep an eye on those efficiencies. Every 1% loss is 1 unit of leccy, out of every 100 that doesn't make it from your roof to your TGM. My ickle SB1200 is only about 92% efficient, so that's a lot of leccy being used to heat the downstairs toilet during the summer!

Mart.

k66

Thanks for that I will have a read between doing my normal Granny duties, making bread etc. I have learnt so much in the last five days thank you everyone for your support.

Martyn1981

k66 wrote: »

Hi Mart, it looks like we are heading for the Panasonic HIT, just a couple more quotes to come in. Thanks for your information. My learning curve is in a twist over inverters now, Fronius or Sunny Boy we want one to be as quiet as possible, I need to find out if they have a cooling fan, I don't want to be woken up at dawn to somethng clicking or whirring in the loft.
I think that I am getting to be an anorak now as I am discussing things like degradation and mounting systems.

Sorry, tried not to ask, but can't help myself. Why are you edging towards 4kWp of HIT's when you can get 4kWp of something else (eg JASolar) for £2k less?

If you're hoping the HIT's will generate a little bit more each year, then why not cover your bets and install 5kWp of the JASolar's. You could run these through a 3.68kW capped SB4000TL. But here's the fun bit. If you pay an extra £100 and install a capped SB5000TL, then ask the DNO for permission to exceed 3.68kW, they might say yes.

Even if they say no, the larger system will outperform the 4kWp HIT's (even after allowing for some capping during good days) and make up for the 10% lower FIT rate. Final bill probably about £1k more (£7k), but still £1k less than the HIT's!

...... or .... ask the DNO first, and if they say yes, still go with the 5kW inverter, but install 6kWp of panels - assuming the roof is large enough, that'll probably come in around £8k.

Mart.

k66

Thanks Mart, am I right in thinking that you can have as many panels as you like as long as the inverter caps it at 4kw?
To do:
check out FIT rates for above 4KW output
amended quotations

Martyn1981

k66 wrote: »

Thanks Mart, am I right in thinking that you can have as many panels as you like as long as you and the inverter will cap the 4kw overproduction?

In a word yes. But a few considerations:-

Roof space and money - only started throwing these ideas at you because you mentioned both, otherwise I wouldn't have tried to confuse you, with my spinny brain and multiple ideas.

As you'll lose some potential to capping, their is a point where it isn't worth bothering. Not sure where that point is, but probably around the 5kWp point.

Exceeding 4kWp means you get a FIT of 13.99p / kWh instead of 15.44p. So you need to consider the lower tariff, against the proportionally lower cost of the install as it gets bigger.

Not trying to be pedantic, but if we're discussing DNO limits, then it's actually 3.68kW limit, not 4kW, just to avoid potential issues.

Check another thread, Dave Fowler just got permission from his DNO, and I got permission last July. But here I was thinking that 5kWp on a 3.68kW limit would work quite well, and be allowed under self-commissioning, but what a bonus if permission was given and the inverter setting could be changed (by an electrician) to allow uncapped generation. That then led on to the 6kWp idea, but only if permission beforehand as capping would start to get too high and be wasteful.

Last thing, panel ratings are given at 25C. When in good sun, panels get hot fast and generally lose about 1% efficiency for every 2.5C rise. So in really sunny hot weather you rarely see more than 90% of your headline figure sustained, and if warm still air that can drop to 70% or so quite quickly over a few days.

Happy to throw loads of ideas at you, and explain them in better detail. Could even take a stab at some rough generation numbers and potential income comparisons. But if I'm confusing you / muddying the waters now, "just say no!".

Mart.

Edit: Just to clarify, my first posts were what I'd do if I were you. My latter posts (as your confidence grew) were what I'd do if it was me. M.