New regs - any change in advice, and fairness?

sophieamelia

Hi there everyone,
I've spent along time perusing the forums and threads and still think I need to start a new one. Sorry if wrong.
Most of the threads on here are from before the legislation change and the advice on MSE about arguing/ignoring fines covers the issue of fairness when deciding what to do. I would like to put my situation here and hope that someone with the legal nous can put my mind at rest that it is still ok to ignore the fine...whoops the 'Civil Parking Notice.'

I parked my car late morning at Kemble train station car park. There were no available spaces. I had my train ticket and needed to park. Similar to many other people in the car park I invented a parking space - it didn't obstruct anybody but it was quite obviously not an official car parking space. The car park is run by Apcoa. I bought my ticket through my phone for two days as I wasn't coming back until the next day.
I have had to invent parking spaces before and not had any trouble, but they are normally better disguised. My parking ticket says it was issued at 14.23 and from experience there would have then been some spaces available by that point and my car would have then stood out as being clearly in the wrong place. My ticket refers to my car being parked in a 'Not Designated Parking Area'

I came back the next day and had a 'civil parking notice' for £80, or £50 if I cough up within 14 days. There is no mention of how to appeal although it does say enquiries can be made to a PO Box address or a 0845 number. I don't want to pay to call a 0845 and found an alternative number on Apcoa's website, when I rang it was just the normal parking ticket ordering line with no other options.

The car park has CCTV so they could potentially show that it was myself driving the car. They also have proper signs up at the station (not visible from where I parked to be fair), they haven't used inappropriate language on the paperwork as they don't call it a fine, etc. Either way, I understand the law change means that the owner is now liable and I am the owner.

My feeling of unfairness comes from that:
I had my train ticket booked for a set train but there was no parking available - there's no parking outside the car park - there's a narrow country lane with no pull-ins leading to overclogged residential area where naturally the residents get upset if you park there. I didn't have time to do laps around the car park, then drive out across the country to a residential estate to try to park in front of someone's house.
I paid for my parking and
I wasn't parked so that any other traffic in the car park was obstructed
Finally, and completely unrelated, I'm not loaded, (I earn £500 a month) and I really don't want to lose the money paying a stupid fine.

If there was parking spaces available and I have then gone and parked somewhere stupid then I would regard the notice as being fair. But, if there's no spaces left and there's a train to catch then what is a person to do? Kemble train station is well known as being lacking in capacity and often full up.

So, do I or do I not pay?
APCOA is a member of the BPA AOS members scheme and has an appeals system but as I parked outside a space I can't see that I could possible be able to win an appeal. I'd have to appeal first to APCOA and from reading on forums it seems that APCOA universally rejects appeals.
If I was to appeal I'd go around the car park at the same time and take photos of all the other cars that have made up spaces but that haven't received ticket by the end of the day...
I am tempted to ignore it, receive threatening letters and wait until they go away. But I would like to check that would be the correct course of action?
Thanks for all advice,
Sophie

pogofish

Err, there must be several hundred post-change threads here now - How on earth did you miss them? They are all right at the top of the forum.

And no, nothing significant has changed. You can still ignore if you want, just like before.

And if you do want to go the POPLA route, you can even ignore that as their result is not binding on you.

RENEGADE_2

The answer to your question became clear once we gleaned the information posted in your first paragraph: "civil parking notice". If it is civil, then civil law applies and whoever owns Kemble's car park may push for losses and this in turn is nothing, because you say you bought a ticket - you simply parked where thy don't like you to, boo-hoo!

Ignore the ticket. APCOA will after 28 days buy keeper details from the DVLA, when they write to you then, just inform us of whether they are citing Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 and POPLA and if so, you can write to deny the legality of their charge; when they refuse that, they give you a POPLA reference number. You then use that when explaining your grievance to POPLA, your enemy APCOA will then have to pay £32 to have POPLA make a decision, but whatever it decides, it is not binding for you, so you can ignore from that point ad infinitum. It will go nowhere.

sophieamelia

Thanks for answering. That's it really. Puts my mind at rest. Can't wait for the threatening letters over Xmas. Such fun. Not.

RENEGADE_2

Hey Sophie. I know Kemble, drove past there Tuesday last, I go to Cirencester quite often as it is such a charming place and I live in Wiltshire, so once north of the M4 I drive up the A429. What I don't get is why anyone in Kemble takes trains when you've got your own airport which is full of aircraft!

Why don't you fly?

Coupon-mad

sophieamelia wrote: »

APCOA

I am tempted to ignore it, receive threatening letters and wait until they go away. But I would like to check that would be the correct course of action?

Yep! Ignore it.

hoohoo

RENEGADE wrote: »

Why don't you fly?

Because Kemble is the place where they take all the aircraft to bits :-)

RENEGADE_2

That and hold major events! I was joking, I never suggested it was Kemble International, with a sparkling departure lounge and the place diverted plains from Bristol and Cardiff land!