Very old lady in need of funds....

Blue_Parrot

....which would you liquidate first?

89-year-old living in sheltered housing (i.e., pays rent etc.) is running out of capital. The only income is UK state pension. My husband with Power of Attorney is the person who actually executes any financial matters. She is in a poor state of health. She's not in the UK. She leaves everything to him, including the anxiety.

She is terrified (lives in a state of permanent anxiety) of running out of money and can't pay the rent, has to be moved to nursing home etcetera. (It looks like it might come to that, but who pays the nursing home fees in Germany, we have no idea.)

Investments are:

UK Government Bond ("granny bond") £2,500
Premium Bonds £200
650 Santander Shares
200 BP Shares


(A meeting with IFA is arranged for next week, but I thought I'd also ask here.)


Thanks for informed replies.

opinions4u

While she still has her marbles I'd get the shares sold.

Makes things easier later on.

srcandas

Blue Parrot I think that comes to about £6500. I'm wondering if it is worth bringing this to a head now rather than waiting till all funds have gone. (apologies if that is what you are doing).

I have family and contacts in Spain and have heard of the UK gov paying towards care in Spain. Now a lot is hearsay but worth asking on the Expat Forums. (Try : expat Germany forum , in google)

Must say your husband is a hero (possibly an accidental one or by choice but nonetheless). Hope someone repays him if he should need such help in many happy years time :beer:

xylophone

only income is UK state pension.

- not precisely if she receives dividends on the shares and interest on the savings?

I am not quite sure what advice an IFA can give on such a small amount of capital?

I imagine that you can liquidate the savings/investments and pass the euro equivalent to the elderly person but (assuming you know how much she pays in rent,food/ power etc), how long will this last?

I wonder whether anybody at the German Embassy could point you in the right direction for getting information on sheltered housing rent/ care home fees in Germany and on who pays if the person needing care can't?

innovate

You don't mention how much the "rent etc" is, but if UK State Pension is her only income, it isn't hard to imagine why she suffers with anxiety.

The investments you list won't last very long - it's only a few K. You say "she leaves everything to my husband" - - - does she own anything else, e.g. property?

I reckon one of the most important issues to resolve are the arrangements should she run out of money. This should not only make life easier for her, but also for your husband.

Sadly, many people can get into such situations, sometimes through no fault of their own. Younger people can work at getting themselves out of such a rut, but at 89, there's really nothing much a person can still do to turn their financial situation around.

bryanb

Does she have German citizenship? Why is she in Germany?

markwilkinson

I find this story, including your other thread quite saddening.

It's not a lot of money is it.

I think we can all take some kind of a warning from this about retirement planning, but that is an aside.

Hard to know what to suggest really. Releasing capital from any or all of those investments/savings is only going to help in the short term.

How long will the £200 from selling the premium bonds, for example last?

Sabre Tooth, on your other thread, suggested hanging on to the BP shares because of the increase in the next dividend. Does that increase justify not realising then now?

I would say, on the face of it, realise it all.

It's so hard trying to suggest what to do, with so little money to deal with. It's been a good exercise in thought for me, 99.9% of the time post questions about what to do with excess funds.

Onawingandaprayer

Not a vast amount, but Attendance Allowance?

https://www.gov.uk/attendance-allowance/overview

Blue_Parrot

srcandas wrote: »

Blue Parrot I think that comes to about £6500. I'm wondering if it is worth bringing this to a head now rather than waiting till all funds have gone. (apologies if that is what you are doing).

I have family and contacts in Spain and have heard of the UK gov paying towards care in Spain. Now a lot is hearsay but worth asking on the Expat Forums. (Try : expat Germany forum , in google)

Must say your husband is a hero (possibly an accidental one or by choice but nonetheless). Hope someone repays him if he should need such help in many happy years time :beer:

Thank you all for the replies. I'll start with this one.

What do you mean by "bringing this to a head now..."?

Thanks for the tip about expat forums. I already know that they yield astonishing (literally eye-boggling) information: for instance.......... anyone who dies in Germany, gets buried/cremated in Germany, even tourists. It's the Law. That came as something of a "surprise".

But I digress.

xylophone wrote: »

- not precisely if she receives dividends on the shares and interest on the savings?

I am not quite sure what advice an IFA can give on such a small amount of capital?

I imagine that you can liquidate the savings/investments and pass the euro equivalent to the elderly person but (assuming you know how much she pays in rent,food/ power etc), how long will this last?

I wonder whether anybody at the German Embassy could point you in the right direction for getting information on sheltered housing rent/ care home fees in Germany and on who pays if the person needing care can't?

Yes, there are tiny dividends and microscopic amounts of interest, but they are insignificant considering the problem.

You're probably right about the ISA but it's worth asking.

We don't know how long the liquidated assets will last....

Do you mean the German Embassy in UK, or the British Embassy in Germany?

innovate wrote: »

You don't mention how much the "rent etc" is, but if UK State Pension is her only income, it isn't hard to imagine why she suffers with anxiety.

The investments you list won't last very long - it's only a few K. You say "she leaves everything to my husband" - - - does she own anything else, e.g. property?

I reckon one of the most important issues to resolve are the arrangements should she run out of money. This should not only make life easier for her, but also for your husband.

Sadly, many people can get into such situations, sometimes through no fault of their own. Younger people can work at getting themselves out of such a rut, but at 89, there's really nothing much a person can still do to turn their financial situation around.

"She leaves everything to my husband..." I meant, she leaves every financial decision to my husband (including the anxiety). The house was sold years ago when she was widowed, and she's been living off the capital ever since. That has now all gone - on sheltered housing rent and massive medical bills. As a UK citizen, there is no state help on the medicine front, there. It is too late, now, to try to change her citizenship to German in an attempt to reduce these fees.

bryanb wrote: »

Does she have German citizenship? Why is she in Germany?

She has UK passport/citizenship. She retired there by choice after her husband died.

Onawingandaprayer wrote: »

Not a vast amount, but Attendance Allowance?

https://www.gov.uk/attendance-allowance/overview

Thanks for that link, but is that allowance paid to overseas UK pensioners? We've already applied for her winter fuel allowance but there has been no reply yet, though she does qualify.

Thank you all again for replying, they are much appreciated.

xylophone

I've just found this - any help at all?
http://www.justanswer.com/european-law/78l9a-hi-i-severely-disabled-pensioner-living-germany.html
"However, since you don’t work but receive a state pension from the UK, the UK is the competent institution for your social security purposes.
Under Article 29 of EU Regulation 883/2004, sickness cash benefits (which includes attendance allowance) is to be paid by the institution of the country which is responsible for the cost of your healthcare (sickness benefits in kind).
Since you receive a pension from the UK and you do not have a right to healthcare benefits in Germany, the UK is solely responsible for your healthcare under Article 24(2)(a) of the Regulation. As a result, the UK is responsible for paying your healthcare costs and your sickness benefits in kind.
The first thing you should do is to contact the International Pension Service to obtain form S1 which confirms that the UK is responsible for your healthcare.
This is their contact details:
https://www.gov.uk/state-pension-if-you-retire-abroad
Once you have this form S1, you should write back to the UK authorities and ask them to reconsider their decision on the basis that you are entitled to claim Attendance Allowance on the basis of Articles 29 and 24(2)(a) of EU Regulation 883/2004 and enclosing a copy of Form S1 that confirms that the UK is responsible for your healthcare.
If that does not help, you should ask assistance from Your Europe Advice, the European Commission’s free on-line service, by sending in an enquiry:
http://ec.europa.eu/citizensrights/front_end/index_en.htm


Read more: Hi I am a severely disabled Pensioner now living in germany. - JustAnswer http://www.justanswer.com/european-law/78l9a-hi-i-severely-disabled-pensioner-living-germany.html#ixzz2BOYg2Zsa"

srcandas

Blue Parrot by 'bringing it to a head' I meant assume all money has been used, ignoring the £6500. Because if the lady needs to return to the UK there will be costs and with a bit of reserve the blow may be softened. Also most help doesn't need you to spend every last penny before you receive anything.

The winter fuel allowance is not applicable to those already living overseas. It is paid to those who were receiving it in the UK prior to moving abroad. Yes it sucks but that is how I see it working for expats in Spain and cannot believe Germany is an exception (always ask though )

:beer: