Teaching - an elite profession

purch

I think the most alarming part of the interview of R4 was the idea that someone could get a Degree, without being at the level of at least grade B in GCSE English or Maths :eek:

MacMickster

Surely the most important qualification for a teacher should be a passion for and knowledge of the subject that they are teaching, and the ability to inspire those that they are trying to teach.

I don't see why a history teacher should be proficient in algebra, nor a PE teacher in English (although mine was in language of the 4 letter variety).

For primary school teachers there should be even less necessity to be able to solve quadratic equations, but far more need for the ability to engage the youngsters in front of them and actually teach.

wymondham

MacMickster wrote: »

Surely the most important qualification for a teacher should be a passion for and knowledge of the subject that they are teaching, and the ability to inspire those that they are trying to teach.

I don't see why a history teacher should be proficient in algebra, nor a PE teacher in English (although mine was in language of the 4 letter variety).

For primary school teachers there should be even less necessity to be able to solve quadratic equations, but far more need for the ability to engage the youngsters in front of them and actually teach.

Indeed you are very correct. Unfortunately though the truth is often different. The teaching system in this country does not encourage flair and passion. I had a frank chat with a teacher a little while ago who complained it was like working in a factory stood next to a conveyer belt - unable to have any impact on what occured before or after the item (child) went past and having so many tick boxes to acheive they were unable to put their own mark on kids....

Where is Robin Williams when you need him! (inspirational teacher in a good film!!)

Davesnave

wymondham wrote: »

The teaching system in this country does not encourage flair and passion. I had a frank chat with a teacher a little while ago who complained it was like working in a factory stood next to a conveyer belt - unable to have any impact on what occured before or after the item (child) went past and having so many tick boxes to acheive they were unable to put their own mark on kids...)

You're right, although it wasn't always like that. I got out when it became impossible to ignore the dictats from on high any longer.:D

However, it probably wouldn't be wise to return to the golden years of the 70s, when laissez faire reached its peak. I remember many strange or very dull teachers in that era, whose interests, whatever they were, did not include the wellbeing of the pupils. The race for the gate at 3.30pm was most unseemly.

Good old days?:rotfl:

Davesnave

MacMickster wrote: »

Surely the most important qualification for a teacher should be a passion for and knowledge of the subject that they are teaching, and the ability to inspire those that they are trying to teach.

Yes.

My daughter, who is very dyslexic, will probably never teach, no matter how high she rises in her field.

She sees this as no big deal though. Her relationship with a multi-national company, which is not hung up about her ability to spell, will ensure that she's employed.

The company have been around longer than the Conservative or Labour Parties.

CKhalvashi

I'm with Lydia on this one; I did part of my PGCE in a reasonably rough school, and the other part in one of the best schools in the area, and during the course, I learned a lot that can't be reasonably transferred into mainstream teaching, possibly as I taught in a reasonably nice school, went for Head of Science, got it in September 2004 (I'd only been teaching 2 years), then left teaching a year later.

Half of what I was actually taught isn't even relevant for what I'm doing now, which still involves being heavily involved with kids.

English isn't my first language, and the best I can do is a GCSE at grade 'C', but my concern is for foreign-born teachers here, who can teach their subject perfectly but wouldn't pass the exams. I know I'd have no chance at A-level English now, as I'm not rehearsed for the exams.

A Belorussian-born lady I went to uni in Russia with, and actually taught in the UK with, in a prime example of this. About 95% of her students get grades above 'B' in Maths each year. I was the same, but with Science.

CK

zagubov

vivatifosi wrote: »

Indeed we do. I think that the whole issue raises an interesting problem for critics. For while it is an idea being brought in by a Conservative Government, it is doing so to imitate best practice from the countries that have the most efficient school systems. One such country cited is Finland, which has tended to be a bit to the left of Britain politially. So if Labour were to criticise the move, the response will be that it uses best practice from largely socialist countries.

On the other hand, if the Conservatives push too hard, then as the second woman said, why is this not going to be mandatory in free schools and academies, where there is greater free rein?

It is unusually a hard area to score political points and I thought Humphreys tried to round out the whole debate. I've heard him being a lot tougher.

Davesnave wrote: »

You're right, although it wasn't always like that. I got out when it became impossible to ignore the dictats from on high any longer.:D

However, it probably wouldn't be wise to return to the golden years of the 70s, when laissez faire reached its peak. I remember many strange or very dull teachers in that era, whose interests, whatever they were, did not include the wellbeing of the pupils. The race for the gate at 3.30pm was most unseemly.

Good old days?:rotfl:

I read about a team of Swedes who visited Finland to find out how they'd overtaken them in educational achievement
A Russian observer told them the secret was that the 70s sort of never really happened in Finland.

It never really happened in Scotland, or I think Northern Ireland or northern England (I think) either, neither of which seem to have suffered the same crisis in confidence in teaching that I'm seeing in SE England.

The whole notion that everyone has to earn everybody else's respect is pretty worthy but I think a baby was thrown out with some bathwater somewhere aloing the line. :eek::eek:

snozberry

DaddyBear wrote: »

I wouldn't mind. Imagine a job where your working day is 6 hours, which includes three breaks totalling 90mins, and you get 13 weeks annual leave per year spread out so that you never have to work more than 7 weeks without a holiday.

I have been a teacher for 13 years now and I would just love, LOVE, a six hour day with a 90 minute break and 13 weeks holidays. I'm not going to get my violin out and whinge about the truths behind my job because I know that this forum is full of the judgemental, narrow-minded teacher bashers who, quite frankly, bore me to tears. There is nothing more interesting to a scary proportion on this forum than hiding behind their laptops/computers/whatever they use to access the 'net to whinge and complain about something they know s0d all about. It's become nothing more than a glorified soapbox.

Yes, there might be some who do take the p1ss but you get that in most professions.

LydiaJ

CKhalvashi wrote: »

I'm with Lydia on this one; I did part of my PGCE in a reasonably rough school, and the other part in one of the best schools in the area, and during the course, I learned a lot that can't be reasonably transferred into mainstream teaching, possibly as I taught in a reasonably nice school, went for Head of Science, got it in September 2004 (I'd only been teaching 2 years), then left teaching a year later.

Half of what I was actually taught isn't even relevant for what I'm doing now, which still involves being heavily involved with kids.

English isn't my first language, and the best I can do is a GCSE at grade 'C', but my concern is for foreign-born teachers here, who can teach their subject perfectly but wouldn't pass the exams. I know I'd have no chance at A-level English now, as I'm not rehearsed for the exams.

A Belorussian-born lady I went to uni in Russia with, and actually taught in the UK with, in a prime example of this. About 95% of her students get grades above 'B' in Maths each year. I was the same, but with Science.

CK

In what way is A-level English relevant? It's a literature qualification, and a specialist subject. Nobody's suggesting that all teachers should have Eng Lit, even at GCSE. What they are all supposed to have is GCSE Eng Lang, which is a core subject and very different.

snozberry wrote: »

I have been a teacher for 13 years now and I would just love, LOVE, a six hour day with a 90 minute break and 13 weeks holidays. I'm not going to get my violin out and whinge about the truths behind my job because I know that this forum is full of the judgemental, narrow-minded teacher bashers who, quite frankly, bore me to tears. There is nothing more interesting to a scary proportion on this forum than hiding behind their laptops/computers/whatever they use to access the 'net to whinge and complain about something they know s0d all about. It's become nothing more than a glorified soapbox.

Yes, there might be some who do take the p1ss but you get that in most professions.

Ignore them. If they really thought it was so easy, they would qualify and become teachers, but they haven't, have they?

It's natural for people who don't get our long holidays to envy them, and it's normal for people that don't work in a particular profession to be unaware of the work that goes on behind the scenes. Don't take it personally.

CKhalvashi

LydiaJ wrote: »

In what way is A-level English relevant? It's a literature qualification, and a specialist subject. Nobody's suggesting that all teachers should have Eng Lit, even at GCSE. What they are all supposed to have is GCSE Eng Lang, which is a core subject and very different.

It's English Language that I was talking about. I didn't even get a 'C' in English Lit. I did get A's in Spanish, Swedish, Italian and Russian, however.

CK