CSA - Income, stuggling to pay bills etc...

wayne0

kevin137 wrote: »

I have not seen my daughter since...! and that is 8 years...! I blame the mother yes, but i also blame the CSA and there incompetence and the government for getting the system soooo wrong...!

well, i agree... i actually have my son with me tonight he has been in bed since 7pm. he will wake between 6 and 8... my ex decided to cut my contact with him when he began having fornightly overnights... this is one of the reasons i have decided to alter my application to the courts from "Access" to "Shared residency"... (i understand shared isnt always 50-50 etc )
but to quote one of my solicitors emails:
"but unfortunately, until an order is in place by the courts, you are stuck with what miss xxxx is willing to give you"

despite no end of letters/emails/phonecalls between solicitors and replies to the like of "miss xxxx believes that a suitable agreement can be reached in mediation" she then decides to go 18 months cancelling every appointment put forward by mediation the day before it was due, after attending the first three.

even on my wedding day it was a war, she refused to let my son attend... and then sent her mother with him. my son atteded the service (about an hour).

oh and as for the moving on... she told me she had cheated and that it wasnt my baby blah blah blah... i found somebody else, had a good job etc. baby was born and she called me up. i had a dna test done privately... (online thing which wouldnt stand up in court but for Piece of mind)... i then paid maintenance myself, i had my daughter with my then GF, couple yrs down the line we got married, and then lost my job,. 9 months on a new baby...

theres no way i believe in abortion. so what can you do ... circumstances change...

Shark

I think you are out of line here shoe diva. Wayne is put in a terrible situation, the amount of csa he is paying is just to big a portion of his household income considering his dependants.

wayne0

shoe*diva79 wrote: »

Sorry, it is worth it. You would be saving £150 per month. You can buy a cheap runaround for a few hundred pounds until your in a better financial position. I agree you need a car, but there are cheaper cars.

so a "decent" old car, is more likely to break down? so when that happens., and i dont have the manuf warranty for a repair, where do i stand? :S?

and as i said before, it wouldnt save me 150. insurance would go up (newer cars are safer and therefore less of a risk= cheaper insurance) also same for fuel etc... i had plenty of old cars. and i was lucky to manage 25mpg out of most of them. 15-20k a year in a car the savings from mpg is soon "recovered"... if i sell my car, and get say 3,500 (best case)
i owe about 6300 last i checked.. this would mean 2,800 left to pay,., add 600 for a "reasonable" family car... so 3400 left on a loan. half the loan... so still 75ish a month...

---

im guessing its true... i will get a lot of Trolling, and TBF i expected it... but when a PWC is involved in replies i should of understood how they would see that they are "entitled" to whatever they wish...

I wasnt / am not looking to get out of paying... i simply asked for information/help based on circumstances. and ABILITY to pay yet still have contact with my son.

I have got a couple of responses, (and a lot of "friendly" replies) but i really dont understand the "hostile" replies off some.

and also, my boss offered to give my wife a job and split my hours with her when i took my first sicknote in.. but immigration status doesnt allow her to work ATM.

but i mentioned to the CSA that my wife was looking to work when she got her clearance and they said that if my hours reduced, it would be deemed as "depriving myself of income"...

despite pain killers etc on prescription and sicknotes etc, he also claimed that if i went onto benefits the same would be considered and full liability taken.

the same case worker claimed that when i owe over 160 (before speaking to manager) that they would take the whole lot of arrears from my wage in one go... leaving me with nothing...

despite the law saying that the most they can take from my wages for arrears is 3.75% of my net income used for the calculation (about £13).

the manager who spoke to me saturday, called PWC about setting up maintenance direct and previous case worker advised her to go for DOE method, as payments would be regular... they failed to mention that payments could be held for up to six months or something if employer forwards them at the "last opportunity available" because they dont have to forward at the same time they are deducted.

so i got an agreement with CSA that i send the variation form. £60 paid was taken off debt, i paid yesterday too. and we are now on maintenance direct for £41 plus £5 a week until arrears are cleared (will take about 30 weeks)

ive looked at my payslips from past 6 months, which show a figure of my income better... could i forward these for a fairer assesment? (my wages average on the forteen fortnightly periods since april as 201 week net (gross earnings YTD - Tax YTD - NI YTD ) / 14 (fortnights)/2(weekly figure)

would the CSA take this information for a fairer assesment? as my wage is obviously shiftbased so fluctuates up and down a lot...

and also, from reading variations have to be approved by PWC... so could mean that i dont have contact with son...

kevin137

You need to get out of your head they are entitled...

And they certainly do not get there way all the time.. But money is a serous factor in bringing up a child, and the government says that you must pay 15% of your income for 1 child, less the 20% for 2 you have in your household...

It is not about what they want it is what the government says you MUST do...!!!

And to do this, they have the CSA the most incompetent bunch of half wits you are ever going to come across (generalisation and not all are), but you know what i mean...!

You need to adjust to what they say you must pay, argue it with them all the way, but you still have to pay in the meantime...!

As others have said, it is not always fair, and the cost can be horrendous... But if you had a child then you have a responsibility wether you like it or not and the options for you right now are very limited, you quit work and sponge on benefits, you move on adjust and live a life with seeing your children, or you become bitter and twisted... It is your choice. No one else can decide for you...

I would revisit the benefits calculator for everything, see what you can do through them, apply for everything you can regardless of you thinking you are not eligible, you may be. And move on with your life...

As an idea, go through some of your old stuff toys, games, electronics etc, see what they are worth and ebay them... I did this a couple of times, got rid of old stuff i no longer used and it made a difference short term to how i functioned... Not a long term solution i know, but every little helps...

As for the arrears i don't know where they got your figure, for that, but i can tell you it is wrong...!!! They can take upto 40% of your income at source using a DEO of which 15% would be the original and then 25% for arrears...! The calculations they use for protected income i have never worked out, but protected income means that if you earn say £900 a month and you have a protected at £650 a month the 40% is out and they can only take £250... The protected is not want you should be looking at as what the government say you need to live, as it is different for everyone according to income, well that is how i saw it anyway... Otherwise if you al had the same you would just get a lower paid job and keep the same protected income...

Imagine how an income of £600 works with that... Meaning you would pay nothing...? Not right is it... I know there is fixed payments for benefit, under £100 and again for under £200 but over that it is percentage...

shoe*diva79

*rolls eyes*

I havent trolled you. I have made some perfectly good suggestions as to how you can move forward, but your negative attitude and it appears bitterness towards your ex prevents you from seeing an amicable solution. Kevin is a NRP and he has tried to show you in the same way I have that there is no getting out of this, its your legal obligation.

Ad shark, if you think £35 out of £320 is far to much to pay, out of proportion etc then its my entitled opinion to think you are deluded :-)

Once again, good luck. I do suspect you will need it. Hopefully you will continue to pay what is due by law from your salary. If not then I for one hope that you do get a DEO for 40% of your salary so your child gets whats due and you will wonder what you ever complained about!

Murphy_Gooner

shoe*diva79 wrote: »

*rolls eyes*

I havent trolled you. I have made some perfectly good suggestions as to how you can move forward, but your negative attitude and it appears bitterness towards your ex prevents you from seeing an amicable solution. Kevin is a NRP and he has tried to show you in the same way I have that there is no getting out of this, its your legal obligation.

Ad shark, if you think £35 out of £320 is far to much to pay, out of proportion etc then its my entitled opinion to think you are deluded :-)

Once again, good luck. I do suspect you will need it. Hopefully you will continue to pay what is due by law from your salary. If not then I for one hope that you do get a DEO for 40% of your salary so your child gets whats due and you will wonder what you ever complained about!

OMG.....Are you actually serious??? Are you trolling??? Yes i certainly think you are.
You come across as the most bitter person who seems to have a massive chip on your shoulder.

AT no point did he say he was refusing too pay. He has merely said he is struggling.
I briefly read all of the replies and at no point is he refusing too pay. He actually says he is working even though he is not at full health. So obviously he is no scrounger and he is wanting to provide what he can.
Who are you to dictate what is an acceptable amount to provide?

And as he has already mentioned above, he has had a messy split from his ex where she has been saying the kid is not his etc.
But he has still paid maintenance and been there.

I'm sure he didn't predict he was going to lose his job and have all this going on with his ex and the CSA which could have been sorted out as responsible adults.
Who are we to say he shouldn't have met someone else and have another child.
Oh so if my partner cheats on me, kicks me out. Does that mean i should live the rest of my life as a single person and if i do happen to meet someone else, say to her "sorry darling, i cant have a kid with you because im going to have to pay a chunk of salary"

Didn't realise we were living in China.

Honestly if you don't have anything constructive or anything which is going to remotely give some advice, then please don't make anymore comments. Because the more you make them, the more you make you're self seem bitter and twisted.

And FYI the CSA cant simply go dishing out DOE's here and there as they may make out.
You might want to check out the Child Support Act 1991
Employers have rights to ask the CSA to provide proof that their employee is actually the liable person for payments.

shoe*diva79

Murphy_Gooner wrote: »

OMG.....Are you actually serious??? Are you trolling??? Yes i certainly think you are.
You come across as the most bitter person who seems to have a massive chip on your shoulder.

AT no point did he say he was refusing too pay. He has merely said he is struggling.
I briefly read all of the replies and at no point is he refusing too pay. He actually says he is working even though he is not at full health. So obviously he is no scrounger and he is wanting to provide what he can.
Who are you to dictate what is an acceptable amount to provide?

And as he has already mentioned above, he has had a messy split from his ex where she has been saying the kid is not his etc.
But he has still paid maintenance and been there.

I'm sure he didn't predict he was going to lose his job and have all this going on with his ex and the CSA which could have been sorted out as responsible adults.
Who are we to say he shouldn't have met someone else and have another child.
Oh so if my partner cheats on me, kicks me out. Does that mean i should live the rest of my life as a single person and if i do happen to meet someone else, say to her "sorry darling, i cant have a kid with you because im going to have to pay a chunk of salary"

Didn't realise we were living in China.

Honestly if you don't have anything constructive or anything which is going to remotely give some advice, then please don't make anymore comments. Because the more you make them, the more you make you're self seem bitter and twisted.

And FYI the CSA cant simply go dishing out DOE's here and there as they may make out.
You might want to check out the Child Support Act 1991
Employers have rights to ask the CSA to provide proof that their employee is actually the liable person for payments.

Why would I troll? I, like several of the other posters have offered the OP advice, for example to check he is getting his full benefit entitlement. If he is unable to work due to illness then he should go onto the relevant benefits so he can regain his health, or not make it any worse.

I haven't said he isn't willing to pay at any point. As he has found out, what he thinks he can afford and what the law says he should pay are 2 different things. He appears to be paying his legal assessment, plus arrears he has incurred but if he does not stick to the agreement then the CSA can and will impose a DEO on his wages.

I have an opinion on what is a acceptable amount to pay - and obviously I personally cant force him to pay it but I believe his assessment is fair. £35 a week would clearly go a lot further supporting his child then £15 a week. Seems the current legislation agrees...

Seeing as you like to figure out my opinion, yes, I don't agree with people having children they cannot afford. I would love to have more children personally, but as I cannot afford it without my current children suffering it will remain a pipe dream (unless I win the lotto then Ill be having a football team :rotfl:)

kevin137

Murphy_Gooner wrote: »

And FYI the CSA cant simply go dishing out DOE's here and there as they may make out.
You might want to check out the Child Support Act 1991
Employers have rights to ask the CSA to provide proof that their employee is actually the liable person for payments.

Yes they can for anyone that is non compliant... And it is very very hard if not impossible to get removed once in place...!

The child support act of 1991 has been amended many times since then and has new legislation as well. It is always better to pay what they want right from the start and not accrue arrears and give them the chance to get into place...

And yes the employer can ask for proof and the answer is very simple, is his name, is his date of birth is his address... If the answer is yes to the 1st 2 then they have enouhg, the address does not even need to be correct, and once ordered you have nothing you can do about it...!

I am a great believer in fighting the CSA and using the courts in necessary, and i did fight on this point.

My case was easily argued to invalidate the order. My address with employer is in Norway, the correspondence address i have for the CSA is Norway, i have a postal address in the UK and they used this for the DEO. I went to court, argued that it was an invalid DEO and was told by the court the CSA had provided enough info for it to be legal and the case was dismissed...!

No other avenues open...

We all know the CSA is a law unto itself, what advice given here has been, you are complaining because you think you cannot afford it. Not that it is unlawful, wrong or anything else...!

They assessed legally, came up with what they say you have to pay, end of story. If it is wrong then appeal it... If not grow up and live with it. It is unfortunate, but that is how it is...!!!

Complaining on here will get you nowhere, you owe it...

FBaby

Although I can sympathise with you OP to a certain degree, I just cannot understand, really cannot, the decision to have more children when you don't have the assurance that you will be able to support the ones you already have. You decide to have one more child, and expect to pay less for your first as a result as his detriment.

My partner and his partner decided to have a child together despite being both nrps to 4 children together and neither paying a penny towards them (well his partner is in share care). Of course they claim it was an accident, except that it wasn't since they had been asking my children for months how they would feel if they had a brother or sister. They had a child selfleshy, but now expect sympathy for their financial situation and consider that as I and my partner are earning a good income, they shouldn't have to contribute because of their situation.

Their situation is what it is because of the choices they have made compared to the choices my partner and I have made (which included not having a child together in the end even though my partner doesn't have children of his own).

OP, you've decided to have two more children, you have to face the fact that this come with additional financial responsibility especially if your partner isn't going to work. Comparing your situation with what it would be if you were unemployed is defeatist and negative. You should compare your situation to what it would be if you had decided to wait to have more children and then you would see a different picture.

jjj1980

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