should cyclists be treated as road-users, or pedestrians?

Man_Overboard_2

As a recent recruit to the world of 'non-drivers', I am impressed by the willingness of drivers generally to give way to pedestrians, especially on zebra crossings.

But, as an ex-professional-driver, I know that drivers are under no obligation to give way to cyclists, even when they are about to push or wheel their bike across a zebra crossing.

I also know that, although it is extremely stupid for a cyclist to creep up the inside of an articulated lorry and then cry foul when the driver 'unexpectedly' turns left, it is also true that if the driver has correctly set his/her mirrors, and is using them effectively, then there is no such thing as a 'blind spot'

benjus

Man_Overboard wrote: »

But, as an ex-professional-driver, I know that drivers are under no obligation to give way to cyclists, even when they are about to push or wheel their bike across a zebra crossing.

I thought that a person wheeling a bike was simply a pedestrian. Do you have any links to back up your assertion that drivers don't have to give way to someone wheeling a bike across a zebra crossing?

thelawnet

A cyclist pushing a bicycle is a pedestrian. This has been determined in law. Hence why it's not an offence for instance to push your bicycle on the pavement.

A lot of cyclists assume that the gutter is where they should cycle. This impression can be reinforced by motorists who insist cyclists don't belong on the road at all.

This is why they end up up the inside of lorries. Personally speaking I usually pass on the right, and try to avoid passing lorries and buses altogether. But as I said the advice you will get from professional cycling trainers is very different from the 'advice' that cyclist-hating motorists would give (get off the effing road, why aren't you in the cycle lane, etc.). So it tends to be the assertive and confident that are safest, and I think this is why so many women get crushed by lorries, because they are less assertive.

benjus

I agree that it's pretty stupid for a cyclist to pass anything on the left, although there's always temptation to do it. However, it opens up several potential scenarios, such as:

• The obvious one - that the driver you are passing/have just passed wants to turn left
• A passenger opening the door to leave the vehicle
• A vehicle in the line of traffic being passed by the cyclist signals to another vehicle in the oncoming traffic wanting to turn right that they intend to give way to them

In fact, if there was any single most important piece of advice to give to cyclists, I think it would be not to pass on the left.

Man_Overboard_2

benjus wrote: »

I thought that a person wheeling a bike was simply a pedestrian. Do you have any links to back up your assertion that drivers don't have to give way to someone wheeling a bike across a zebra crossing?

I just checked - rule 79 of the highway code advises me to dismount whilst crossing a zebra crossing. I do that anyway, but now I no longer have to worry about my 'rights'!

It certainly used to be the case that cyclists were not entitled to use zebra crossings, even whilst dismounted, but it makes perfect sense that the rule has been changed.

mansars

If they are wearing a helmet, have lights and wear clothing that is visable in low light conditions I would say that they are a road user...and I generally treat this type of cyclist with respect that they deserve (being a part time one myself).

However, the rest ...well they should be treated with the same disatin that they are treating the laws of the road imho.

on your point of a dismounted cyclist crossing a zebra crossing, then they are definetly a pedestrian, in the same way some one pushing a pram is.

Man_Overboard_2

benjus wrote: »

if there was any single most important piece of advice to give to cyclists, I think it would be not to pass on the left.

I think your 'rule' should be included in the next edition of the Highway Code.
But I also think that more work should be done on the need to educate the drivers of large vehicles in how to set and use their mirrors effectively.

thelawnet

mansars wrote: »

If they are wearing a helmet, have lights and wear clothing that is visable in low light conditions I would say that they are a road user...and I generally treat this type of cyclist with respect that they deserve (being a part time one myself).

Those are personal choices, albeit that cyclists should be visible as it can't be fun to hit one, but it's not your business at all whether someone wears a helmet or not.

As it happens my considered view is that you are safer without one.

But motorists should wear them.

However, the rest ...well they should be treated with the same disatin that they are treating the laws of the road imho.

Helmets and hi-vis are not laws of the road.

Most motorists have disdain for the laws of the road, but if I see a car ahead doing 40mph through a 30mph village I'm not going to treat him with disdain, I'm just going to continue driving/cycling for my own personal safety while trying not to endanger others.

Enough to worry about in life without trying to judge people from a distance for no reason.

Rotor

benjus wrote: »

I agree that it's pretty stupid for a cyclist to pass anything on the left, although there's always temptation to do it. However, it opens up several potential scenarios, such as:

• The obvious one - that the driver you are passing/have just passed wants to turn left
• A passenger opening the door to leave the vehicle
• A vehicle in the line of traffic being passed by the cyclist signals to another vehicle in the oncoming traffic wanting to turn right that they intend to give way to them

In fact, if there was any single most important piece of advice to give to cyclists, I think it would be not to pass on the left.

All three of your points apply equally to passing on the right as well ( turning right not left , obviously , and passenger in rear seat) so should cyclists never overtake left OR right? Or should drivers take responsibility for checking?

Rotor

should cyclists be treated as road-users, or pedestrians?



Well the police seem to consider cyclists as pedestrians - just ask Andrew Mitchell. Couldn't be arsed to open gate for one

Dekazer

Well if you're going to get into a conversation about 'should's, then you should read the Highway Code.

All road users should be treated as detailed in the Highway Code. I can't see anything confusing about that.

Oh, and if you see a road user behaving dangerously that does NOT give you the right to behave dangerously in response. You should continue to navigate safely along the road.

Do as you would be done to people, or do as you would have others do to your mother/child/sister/husband. Stay safe out there