advice re suspension and writing letter to employer

jobbingmusician

wrightk wrote: »

i received a reply from the employer. they seem to have misread my letter about representation and have read into it that i am complaining that i am unable to contact colleagues about representation and have said they can do this for me.

Yes, this is what your letter said, as you said in post 4 that you weren't allowed to contact any of them, and this is patently unfair. It doesn't cover the employer if they contact colleagues for you, as you would need a chance to meet up and discuss the circumstances of the case before the hearing.

wrightk wrote: »

My issue is i am being offered representation but am being told that i am allowed to ask a colleague to accompany me but it has to be noone involved in the investigation. 2 of my colleagues are suspended which relates to my investigation, my other colleagues have given evidence against me. so how can i get anyone from work who is not involved

'it would not normally be reasonable for workers to insist on being accompanied by a companion whose presence would prejudice the hearing'- ACAS

how can someone who has given evidence against me be impartial at the meeting. and how am i meant to get anyone to represent me when they are involved in the investigation, when i have been explicitly told not to?how is this fair

This is a separate issue, and not quite as strong. Presumably you want another of the suspended colleagues to accompany you. I take it from your posts that there is no-one who is not either suspended or testifying against you? I suggest you write something like the below. (This may need further work before sending)

Thank you for your reply, advising me that you could contact a colleague to enable them to accompany me to the hearing. The ACAS guide to disciplinaries (available at http://www.acas.org.uk/media/pdf/s/o/Acas-Guide-on-discipline-and-grievances_at_work_%28April_11%29-accessible-version-may-2012.pdf) stresses that I have the right to be accompanied to any hearing which could result in disciplinary action, and that it would not be reasonable to insist on being accompanied by a colleague whose presence would prejudice the hearing or who might have a conflict of interest. I understand that several of my colleagues have presented evidence which might be used against me, so I would prefer that the following were contacted to accompany me.

so that I can discuss with them who would be best placed to accompany me. It seems that there is no-one who is not involved in this case, so I will need you to contact one of the other suspended staff. I will of course need to talk to my colleague before the hearing - the ACAS guide makes it clear that my companion should be allowed to put my case, and I find it difficult to understand how this role is to be carried out if you are contacting the colleague rather than letting me talk to them direct. I would be grateful to hear from you further as to how you envisage my right to be accompanied being accomplished, if you still maintain that I am not allowed to contact my colleagues.

wrightk

thanks for your reply ill send them that today. although in their response yesterday they gave me until the end of the day yesterday to contact them (which is a little unfair), else they said none of my colleagues would be available at such short notice (hearing is on thursday)

wrightk

im not sure whether i should just go alone, if then any action is taken against me i can appeal on the grounds they didnt follow correct procedure then it will give me more time to arrange representation as they havent given me very long to prepare or arrange representation

Mands

wrightk wrote: »

My issue is i am being offered representation but am being told that i am allowed to ask a colleague to accompany me but it has to be noone involved in the investigation. 2 of my colleagues are suspended which relates to my investigation, my other colleagues have given evidence against me.

Are there only three other employees, aside from management, in the company?

wrightk

Mands wrote: »

Are there only three other employees, aside from management, in the company?

3 who are not suspended and have given the management a statement which they will use against me, and 2 who are suspended, so 5 in total, all who are involved

Mands

wrightk wrote: »

3 who are not suspended and have given the management a statement which they will use against me, and 2 who are suspended, so 5 in total, all who are involved

Then you need to ask if, under the circumstances, they will allow you to bring an external person with you.

jobbingmusician

Mands, in my letter I have thrown the problem back at the company, asking how they think [STRIKE]representation[/STRIKE] accompaniment will work. OP, would you consider employing a solicitor if you feel that your job is at risk? Do you know anyone who would make a good job of supporting you?

I'm trying to avoid the word representation, at least while you are talking to your employer. They haven't offered you representation, AFAIK, only to be accompanied. Of course if you have a skilled person accompanying you they may get away with quite a lot of representation, especially given the ACAS stuff I quoted which recommends that they be allowed to speak. The word to use to your employer is accompaniment (and your employer might throw a wobbly if you turned up with a solicitor - another reason for putting the problem back in their court).

They should, by the way, delay the hearing by up to a week to allow you to arrange this. ACAS says 'The employer should allow a
companion to have a say about the date and time of a hearing. If the companion cannot attend on a proposed date, the worker can suggest an alternative time and date so long as it is reasonable and it is not more than five working days after the original date.'

wrightk

thankyou so much. i have received a reply from my employer. they gave me a list of people that work in the company (none of my collueagues) and people i dont even know and said i can choose which one and they will give me their contat details. they offered to push back the date until next monday but seen as i dont even know these people id just prefer to go by myself.

i have my disciplinary today. i have made a prepared statement on paper and picked apart the managements case piece bypiece and hopefully discredited all of it.

ill let you know the outcome later

thanks again

wrightk

well that went extremely badly. management seemed to get very annoyed about the fact i brought in a prepared statement along with the points i made that discredited their evidence.
both the 'note taker' and the proprietor were basically having a go at me and seemed to be ganging up on me

ohreally

wrightk wrote: »

both the 'note taker' and the proprietor were basically having a go at me and seemed to be ganging up on me

The note taker should have been reminded of their role!

The chair should have brought in the investigating officer to deliver their findings and get the hearing under way, then it should have been you dealing with the chair who hopefully was impartial.

Was there an HR presence to provide the chair with advice and ensure procedural compliance?

What was the outcome?