Natwest refuse to Refund my money after fraud

humanracer

I used to work for a bank and sadly it is true that Pin transactions are not seen as fraud. This is because the banks believe that chip and pin cannot be cloned therefore Pin fraud is impossible.

However you need to find all the facts regarding this. You said you never ordered a new pin and card. Who did then and how did they intercept the new card? If it was done via Telephone Banking then the bank may be at fault if they did not have adequate security measures.

Hintza

OP to get your money back it looks as if you are going to have to build a case, so gather evidence dates times etc when events took place. You need to find a chink in the banks argument somewhere.

jjj1980

I have been going through a similar issue with Halifax since middle of 2009!! Still no closer to a resolution.

After reporting to their Fraud Team and the police, I was told by Halifax that they believed I did not withdraw the money, nor did I allow anyone else to. However, they could not be certain that someone close to me had not picked up on my PIN whilst out together and then managed to sneak my card away from me on a few occasions. The only person with this access would have been my now ex-husband. I did tell them this and also that I had never given my my PIN. They said the only way forward would be to sign a statement to say that if found, I was willing to press charges against whoever took the money, whether they be family, friend or stranger.

I signed this which they said would mean they could ask the police to obtain the CCTV from the places where the cash was withdrawn - all garage forecourts, some I had no idea existed till team police showed me them on a map! However, 9 weeks after, Halifax had still not sent the request to the garages, by which time, after me contacting all the garage head offices myself, I had found out they cycle the CCTV tapes every 4 weeks so I had no way of finding out who took the money. It was the remainder of my redundancy money, which I was holding onto to pay for my daughter pram, cot etc as I was 22 weeks pregnant the time.

Not only did the bank refuse to help, ignoring totally that the Banking Code and FOS conditions state its up to the Bank to prove your guilt, not the customers responsibility to prove their innocence, they stopped me from being able to do anything privately via the police. The police could only look into it if the bank asked temperature to or said they would late support me in bringing charges privately. Bank are also now trying to make me repay the overdraft caused by the withdrawals.

At the time the money was taken I was suffering with pregnancy complications, dealing with the admission from my ex that he had not been paying the house bills for months, despite showing. Each receipts. Later on he admitted team receipts were fake. There were no visitors to the house during the time the money was taken, I was mostly on bed rest so was not really watching which room my handbag was in. Doors had Yale locks so had to be opened by key and we had not given any spars to anyone. I meant every word I signed to that I would prosecute whoever took the money as they had no rights to it, it was my redundancy money, was going towards paying for things my baby needed. In the end, I had her early, without a moses basket, pram and only a few clothes.

After I had her, once you,even but housebound as still had no pram and stuck in as was waiting 6 weeks of the company-section, I found money had been taken out again, on the newer card I had. My ex admitted hose withdrawals but as they only totalled £130, bank and police aren't interested. He said he had been watching where my hands had fallen on the pinpad and worked out the PIN.

Sorry for the vent but I don't think this will be a quick resolution for you.

Hintza

jjj1980 wrote: »

I have been going through a similar issue with Halifax since middle of 2009!! Still no closer to a resolution.

Sounds like your ex in this case?

arcon5

Find out what machines and branches was used, then see if you have any receipts or transactions in your other account that put you in a different location. This will help your case a little

malkie76

arcon5 wrote: »

Find out what machines and branches was used, then see if you have any receipts or transactions in your other account that put you in a different location. This will help your case a little

That doesn't prove fraud, nor would any CCTV footage showing someone else taking the money.

The bank will assert that you willingly gave your card to someone else, and your PIN to empty your account, then claim it was fraud to try and double your money.

I'm with NatWest, and they are pretty useless at customer care. Besides, everytime I've taken money out over the counter all I've needed was the PIN, and no further ID checks.

The thing you need to do is work out who ordered your new card and intercepted it, then used it. Telephone and internet banking require a second level of security - ie your password after your PIN, which would be impossible to steal or copy unless you had it written down.

This is the area you need to focus on to get your claim sorted out.

transient

I would be looking if the bank were negligent in ordering a new card and pin

jjj1980

Hintza wrote: »

Sounds like your ex in this case?

Yep!! But because the bank were so slow in doing anything, I can't prove it. My ex has the morals of dog poo!

unholyangel

malkie76 wrote: »

I'm with NatWest, and they are pretty useless at customer care. Besides, everytime I've taken money out over the counter all I've needed was the PIN, and no further ID checks.

Thats because the muppets higher up had a brainwave that its much harder to steal/hack/guess a 4 digit pin than it is to steal someone's face.

IMO over the counter withdrawals should be mandatory photo ID. They used to require ID....at least in 2 of my local branches for Bank of Scotland and Lloyds TSB (albeit this was somewhat 10-15 years ago). Again personally, I'd expect a bank to look after my money with reasonable care and skill........letting someone walk away with 10k of my money without even checking who they are all because they have the magic word (or in this case number) just seems utterly idiotic.

Anyone remember the fiasco some years ago about peoples bank details being stolen, used fraudulently etc, banks saying tough, your fault you must have given them the details.....and then it all coming out (on watchdog i think?) that it was actually the banks fault as they had disposed of print outs of account details without destroying them adequately and disposing them in an area anyone could get into. Apparently they were fined for it. And did they take precautions against this in future? No. They were caught doing it again when watchdog (?) went back to check a few months later.