Co-housemate falsely accusing of non-payment of bills.

Apexilon

Hello MSE forum - this is my first post but I shall try to cut to the crux of the matter. My partner and myself rented a 3-bedroom house with another couple between October 2011 and June 2012 on a shared lease through an estate agent, but by Feb 2012 the other couple started making accusations of us not paying bills and got very abusive towards us.

This I tried to quickly diffuse by proving that they were wrong and we were infact paying our share of all utility bills, providing statements from various utility companies, as well as my bank statements to reconcile figures. These they refused to even look at or acknowledge and flat out labelled as "garbage". Next they started leaving notes in the kitchen (communal area) with more abuse, and claiming it was "their house" (as mentioned, its a shared lease with 3 names on the lease, exception being my partner) and that my partner nor myself had any right to open "their bills" as our names were not on the bills, citing as criminal offence. Apart from the fact our names were on the bills, the only mail we opened that had their names on it were household bills which also had my name on it, however insisting we pay amounts they quoted to us for utility bills even though they were not prepared to present us the bills as they maintained were "theirs".

We took this matter up witht he estate agent to see if we wrong on any point, on the one hand dismissed it as "confusion" on their part however maintained as it was joint lease we (all 4) were within our rights to open any of the household bills on principle we lived there, consumed and all contribute financially.

Eventually the continuous abuse (every week) escalated into the (ex) housemates witholding [garage] keys were my partner and myself stored the rest of our belongings so we could not access them, saying the only way we would get the keys would be to pay the bills that we owed (nb: we did not) into "their" bank account as

"I had to grow up, be a man and learnt o pay my bills". For the record the various utility company statement still showed my share as upto date.

When the next bills arrived in April they not only (again) insisted the money be put in their bank account (as only proof they were prepared to accept) but also maintained bills were still outstanding being our fault. It turns out we were quickly able to match up all payments to my bank account, and receipt numbers and authorisation codes in a diary I keep for payments, but they were unable to match theirs. They in each case blamed the individual company (including council tax) of not updating their records. againw e spoke to the estate agent who simply advised we "do whatever necessary to keep the peace". So we put the april 2012 payments for all bills (bar council tax) into their personal bank accoutn to forward on. this they failed to do based on utility statements I requested in May a the only account updated was the council tax which I paid directly - their share had not been paid on this.

We spoke to the estate agent again who finalyl relented we were not getting on and the only way to resolve was to break the lease: my partner and myself would give 2 months notice (upto end of July 2012), and the other couple would go through the reference checks. If they passed then the new lease just in theiir names would come into effect start of August 2012. If they failed then they lose their right to stay n the house and we all move out end of July. We gave our 2 months notice towards the end of May, but foudn a property and moved 15th June and advised utility companies who updated the accounts (closing existing and openeing new ones where necessary) as our consumption liabilities ended there.

The ex-housemates have since been leaving harassing voicemails and texts accusing us of leaving without paying bills, first the figure was £300, now they have upped it to

"£2,500, plus interest" which the male half claims he will get "one way or the other - so watch your back". He has since included RENT on this claiming I owe him, even though the rent was clealry stated to be paid directly to the estate agent who never once flagged an issue with any month being missed.

For the record when I contacted the council regarding the outstanding (and summons for us all to appear to appear in court) they quickly say the payments for my partner and self, with proof of dates, figures and receipt numbers matched up to more than half rounded up and quickly told us they would update their records and resend new letters just to the ex-housemantes. Every utility company followed suit and cleared me us of any outstanding, red letters or attachment of earning to the ex-housemantes where possible. Even the deposit on the house has not been returned by the estate agent as their practise is all parties agree the amounts each person is to be refunded back, but on my presenting my figures (my deposit contribution less agreed deductions) they disagree with this claiming I should get less the figure (as much as half) but not prepared to say why or present figures how they arrive at the figure. So the total sum is in limbo.

The ex-housemates have since taken to informing all our mutual friends that my partner and self are liars and cheats and (now) owe upto £4,000, and has since been in communication with another individual to "break my legs" should he come across me. This we have proof of and have since reported and has been followed up. However the false claims persist.

Now as a civil matter, the ex-housemate refuses to file for money he alleges I owe (as I do not and he has no proof of any), but how do I get him to cease and stop spreading lies as our mutual friends have since cut off myself and partner. Its vindication I seek, not compensation.

Sorry its long winded, but advice appreciated.

System

They sounds like bad people.

If your mutual friends take the side of a couple that are threatening you with physical violence then I would suggest that they are friends you don't want to have.

I wouldn't let it worry you, if there is no civil case then there is no real problem (apart from losing some friends)

Apexilon

thanks for the reply - I try not to let it bother me, but I get the impression they tell people what portion of what tale they feel sounds better:

They'll claim we owe but won't mention me presenting proof we don't.
They'll claim I refused to pay (because I don't owe) but not mention leaving harassing calls and texts.
They even accused me of beign a bully and supposedly picking on her (the female half), which is strange as I'm 5'7", age 33 and no kids. she is 45, stands 5'11" and has 2 kids, one of which has had a second kid. I work in an office, she is head of security for a high profile security firm, and he is an ex-boxer and former sparring partner to a UK-based world champion. But I'm apparently the bully?

I just wish there was a way I could legally make them present their argument once and for all or face consequences.

CIS

For the record when I contacted the council regarding the outstanding (and summons for us all to appear to appear in court) they quickly say the payments for my partner and self, with proof of dates, figures and receipt numbers matched up to more than half rounded up and quickly told us they would update their records and resend new letters just to the ex-housemantes

The council can chase the other occupiers but you are also legally responsible for the balance outstanding and the council can enforce payment solely against you if they so wish.

Apexilon

CIS wrote: »

The council can chase the other occupiers but you are also legally responsible for the balance outstanding and the council can enforce payment solely against you if they so wish.

Hiya, - I completely appreciate this but I presented my case on the phone to show of the 4 of us 2 had paid at least half and could present proof, and did not feel it would be fair to make the same 2 pay again while the other 2 (who could not prove payments towards the outstanding) should not have to.

I explained the worst case scenario being we are all instructed by the court to pay the oustanding, of which if I (again) paid towards it (their share) and they still failed to then it would be back to square one: the ex-housemates simply did not recognise that it was for them to pay, but felt no obligation to provide any supporting paperwork or figures to backup their reasoning other than "cause we say so".

CIS

and did not feel it would be fair to make the same 2 pay again while the other 2 (who could not prove payments towards the outstanding) should not have to.

The law doesn't take this in to account (which can be a problem in cases like this) and 'fairness' isn't something it considers when determining liability to pay.

edgex

Apexilon wrote: »

So we put the april 2012 payments for all bills (bar council tax) into their personal bank accoutn to forward on. this they failed to do based on utility statements I requested in May a the only account updated was the council tax which I paid directly - their share had not been paid on this.


The ex-housemates have since been leaving harassing voicemails and texts accusing us of leaving without paying bills, first the figure was £300, now they have upped it to "£2,500, plus interest" which the male half claims he will get "one way or the other - so watch your back". He has since included RENT on this claiming I owe him, even though the rent was clealry stated to be paid directly to the estate agent who never once flagged an issue with any month being missed.

The ex-housemates have since taken to informing all our mutual friends that my partner and self are liars and cheats and (now) owe upto £4,000, and has since been in communication with another individual to "break my legs" should he come across me. This we have proof of and have since reported and has been followed up. However the false claims persist.

who have you reported the threats to?
if it was the police, then you also need to get them involved with the harassment (voicemails & texts that youve kept?) & with regards to the misappropriation of the april bills money


as for the money owed to various utilities & the council, see a solicitor!
it may well be that the best course of action is to sue the couple for all the outstanding monies. an official letter from a solicitor could be enough to scare them into paying up for their share of the outstanding bills.

Fire_Fox

You are jointly and severally liable for the bills because it was a joint tenancy, that means until the total amount is paid by whoever they can find you ARE in debt. If the court orders you to pay there is no point in paying another share, that will not clear the debt because you are each liable for the full amount. You may then be able to make a civil action (small claims) against your housemates to get the extra you paid refunded.

As to the threats and harassment contact the police. For libel/ slander contact your solicitor. The ex-mutual friends are clearly not your real friends so find new ones, life is not fair unfortunately. Bullying has nothing to do with size or age or occupation, pointless counter argument.

Lastly check your credit reports with the main credit reference agencies, you could have late payments or defaults that you may be able to ask your creditors to remove.

missile

edgex wrote: »

who have you reported the threats to?
if it was the police, then you also need to get them involved with the harassment (voicemails & texts that youve kept?) ....

+1, then you could honestly tell all your fairweather friends "we have reported them to the police" which would surely destroy their credability.

Colin2511

I have no knowledge of how the law works regarding the liability of the outstanding debts (ie utilities making you pay for any shortfall / arears of bills) as I dont know about joint tennancy / lease (would this be similar to a "marriage" where both partners are jointly liable?

What I would do though is see a solictor - take note of every payment that was due, the date you paid your share, copies of statement etc - in a neat order (as you are paying for their time).

I would then ask him/her to write to your former housemates - outlining the facts that you dispute any payment owed - and enclose a copy..and that if they continue you will seek action for defamation/ slander (if either can apply)

I would also contact the police about the threats of violence - as you never know, some prat may follow through (as you dont know what they are told) - I would also follow this every time there is a new threat - keep copies of all voicemails / text and update the police.

hopefully the solicitor letter and the police might defuse things..but I agree you might need to find a new circle of friends, as their grudge will taint friendships.

I would also check your credit records.

Mindless_Clone

You could contact the police about the threats of violence and harassment. Keep any texts or voicemails. Make a note of dates and times of everything. The police can and will act if they are threatening to break your legs, particularly if you say you feel you are afraid they will carry out their threats. The very least they will do is send a nice copper round to have a chat and warn them.

As for what they are telling all your mutual friends, you could just make a simple statement of denial that you repeat to anyone who asks... something along the lines of "what is being said about me owing this money is untrue, we have settled all debts on breaking our rental agreement and I have the evidence to support this. I would be happy to show this if you need proof". You then don't really need to say more on the subject; people will side whatever way they want to side. Just be dignified about it and it will go a lot further than protesting too much.

The other option would be to get a solicitor to send them a cease and desist letter (for both the harassment, threats of violence and the slander/defamation... becuase that is essentially what this is). This, obviously, would require evidence of what they said to whom, when and where (and they sound stupid enough to probably slap it all over social media sites so probably not hard). The difficulty here is you might be asking your mutual friends to make statements supporting you, and thus putting them in a position of taking sides. If they don't stop then you have an option to take it further and actually issue legal proceedings (a private injunction or a sue for defamation etc.).

On the whole, I would expect most of your mutual friends probably know that you don't owe this money, and the ones who believe your ex housemates probably aren't worth having as your friends any more anyway. I daresay they will soon move on to being horrible to someone else and things might die down on their own so if you do nothing at all, it will eventually resolve itself.