Overly strong dogs, best collars or harnesses.

stef240377

I wondered if anyone has any advice or recommendations for harnesses or collars.

I have a 13 month old staffy cross rotty. He is far too strong for his own good and as a result either my son or husband walk him.
We had him from approx 6 months old due to neglect from previous owners. He had no basic training up to that point and even now has issues with anxiety and over excitement.

Within days of getting him home took him to pets at home and kitted him out with a body harness - not the nasty staffy leather ones, the walking control ones and a halti which were tested to be the right size for him. The first week he broke through the harness and chewed up the halti depsite distraction techniques being used.
He does walk on a normal lead with a standard collar but with his strength the collars can not withstand the strain on them. While walking him my husband makes him sit at short intervals because theres so much strain on the collar its making him gasp as he walks, so he is made to sit and calm down before moving on but after several months he has not broke the habit.

Only a few minutes ago my husband set off out with him again only to return in seconds in a strop, they had barely made it to the bottom of the drive as the loop that the lead clips onto has broken. Son now changed collar and off out again. (we have to keep a spare incase this happens)

With our other dog we had used a lead before that had like a bungee effect so that if they went too far they sprung back till they learnt to walk correctly but my husband found it placed a lot of stress on his shoulders agrevating an existing health condition so need something that will benefit both of them.

Mortgage_Reduction_Novice

A halti style collars are often recommended for walking keen/strong dogs. I think because the nose strap doesn't feel as comfortable when they pull where as a neck collar puts the strength through their shoulders making their pull more forceful.

Did he chew the halti while it was on? Or perhaps he took it and chewed it - in which case it needs putting away in a drawer.

Perhaps it's some training that the dog needs, not a specific collar. Walking to heel.

stef240377

He chewed the halti while it were on, somehow whilst having a run off the lead on the main field by the house he had got it from under his chin and chewed straight through it.

The walking to heel with the treats is what hubby has been implementing, hence me saying everytime he pulls and starts gasping he is then asked to sit, rewarded then moving on. So despite knowing what it is all about he is just a stubborn little get. Must say though even through all his gasping towards the end of the walk as he is tiring he is more settled and i know in time it will settle further as he gets older i just need to find an indestructable collar/harness in the meantime.

Mortgage_Reduction_Novice

I see the full picture now and I've never seen halti's made from anything other than woven stuff which is easily chewable. I guess it is just a matter or being more stubborn!!!

krlyr

I have a Rottie cross who is pretty strong and with her knack for spotting squirrels a mile away, I need to have good control over her to save us both being pulled into the road. To help matters, my GSD is reactive to other dogs (big wuss is scared of them - a little terrier can have his knees knocking, bless!) so, again, I needed something to give me control over him for everyone's safety.
I had previously tried quite a few headcollars - Haltis were OK but moved around too much, the Canny Collar seemed to put a lot of pressure on the throat so not much better than a flat collar, and the Gentle Leader kept coming loose. I then tried the Dogmatic headcollars and haven't looked back - been using them about 3 years now.
I went for the leather ones so that they'd be sturdier, they aren't completely solid but quite rigid so may do a good job of staying out of the way of your boy's teeth. Here's Casper modelling his



They're not cheap, but they are well-made, as I've said, I've used them for nearly every walk for the last 3 years and they're still no where near needing replacing.

As well as the headcollar, I use secure harnesses - Casper has learnt to wiggle out of a normal one so I had to buy a harness with a third strap around the belly (meant it could go tighter than his chest circumference so couldn't be slipped out of), I found it so good that I bought Kiki one too. It's the Ruffwear webmaster - again, not cheap but good quality, and they're washable too. The white piping has split a little after all the washing needed (Kiki loves to roll in stinky things!) but that's just an aesthetic issue and only minor. I often walk the dogs on long lines as there's not loads of places to let them off-lead around me, and the harnesses hold up to a 35/40kg dog running to the end of the line so they're pretty sturdy.


What I do is use a Halti training lead (another product I'd recommend - comfy on the hands yet strong, though not chew-proof unfortunately) which has a clip on each end, and clip one end to the headcollar and one end to the harness. I hold the harness end shorter, so that most of the pressure is on the harness, and then if I need the extra control of the headcollar I can hold the lead closer on that end. You don't want to be constantly pulling against the dog's neck, and certainly not jerking on it, so I prefer doing it this way to make the most of both pieces of equipment.
http://www.petplanet.co.uk/product.asp?dept_id=484&pf_id=51744&co=fr&gclid=CP-kneOwj7ICFQfMtAodiF0A_Q

If you do go down the headcollar route, try to introduce it slowly - ideally it should become like a collar, something he gets so used to wearing that he doesn't try chewing it off or anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMR2My1beiU

For looselead walking, I've found the 300 peck method to be a pretty good one. You're basically rewarding every step the dog walks without pulling - starting from 1, and moving on. It makes for much less disappointment as you have really easy, attainable goals - getting the dog to take one step without pulling is a really easy starting point obviously!
http://www.pawsitivelydogs.co.uk/300peck.pdf

I wouldn't be asking him to sit before rewarding him though as you may inadvertantly be teaching him a bit of an odd walking style - you want to reward the act of walking nicely beside you, not sitting next to you. This is where clicker training can come in handy as once the dog has been primed to the clicker, you can use it to mark a particular behaviour - so the instant the dog is right next to you at the ideal position, you click, and it doesn't matter if you take 5 seconds to hand a treat to him, he'll learn that it was the action he was doing at the sound of the click that you're rewarding. If you find it difficult to hold a clicker, lead and treats at the same time, you can swap the clicker for using a bridge word - clickers tend to be used for the benefit of being the same tone/volume every time but a bridge word say in a fairly similar, neutral tone will achieve a similar thing.

stef240377

http://i48.tinypic.com/34ybvo5.jpg
Hoping this link works to show a pic of my two, the offender is the one on the left.

Caroline_a

Another vote for the Dogmatic. It's more padded than the Halti, plus my German Shep learned very quickly how to twist slightly and bite the webbing of the Halti... when I'd gone through 4 in as many weeks, I looked around for an alternative solution. He accepted the Dogmatic without a hitch at all. I would say though that these headcollars should not be used with an extending lead as a hard tug when the dog is running can (and apparently has) injured dog's backs. Better to try to teach a bombproof recall and just use the headcollar for lead walking when the dog should be close.

stef240377

We dont use those extending leads as husband doesnt like them or feel they would take his strength, just the padded handled chain types - he chewed through others like the nylon woven ones when middle son 'forgot' to put it up. Will look into the dogmatic.
How do you go about sizing them so i know i would be getting correct size, although he has the staffy face he has got a fairly hefty head on him if you compare it to a standard staff. Looking on the listing he would either need the 3 or 3l.

Fire_Fox

Why don't you watch a load of 'It's me or the Dog' episodes? Plenty of strong adult dogs on there are brought to heel with the right training. The current situation sounds dangerous for all concerned.

stef240377

It is far from dangerous, he pulls on the lead. If and when collars have broken he doesnt run off. he responds to voice controls. He is happy to walk at the side of you without a lead but the new dog controls that our local authority have brought in state dogs are only to be allowed ofF lead when on a designated exercise area. He is sociable with other dogs he does not go after them more the other way round.

Stephb1986_2

Krlyr your dog is adorable!! he's so cute!! give him cuddles for me

Steph xx