can employers reclaim training costs after they dismiss you???

Uncertain

Notmyrealname wrote: »

OK...

First of all, you can be dismissed without reason in the first 12 months of your employment if it commenced prior to April 2012 and 24 months if it commenced after that so you can seek all the advice you want but unless you can prove it was on the grounds of discrimination (race, sex, religion) then you're on a hiding to nowhere.

Secondly, yes they can reclaim the costs if it is stated in your contract or terms of employment. Even if you haven't signed a contract, you are deemed to have accepted it by continuing to work there. It is pretty standard to include a clause stating a 2 or 3 year employment period. Check your contract and also any employee handbook as this also forms part of your contract and terms of employment. No deductions can be made from your salary unless by prior consent or a court order - if your employment contract mentions that they can then this would be considered prior consent, regardless of whether or not you signed it.

Two points.........

The OP states that he has been employed for "just under a year" so is not affected by the recent change. If a week's statutory notice (not the four weeks he has been give presumably contractually) takes him over a year's employment then he could potentially claim unfair dismissal.

As far as I recall the right to reclaim training costs has to be specifically agreed in writing. I agree that in other respects the employment "contract" would be valid whether signed or not.

KiKi

Uncertain wrote: »

The OP states that he has been employed for "just under a year" so is not affected by the recent change. If a week's statutory notice (not the four weeks he has been give presumably contractually) takes him over a year's employment then he could potentially claim unfair dismissal.

Glad somebody mentioned this as I was just about to! OP, does your 4 week notice take you over a year's service?

As far as I recall the right to reclaim training costs has to be specifically agreed in writing. I agree that in other respects the employment "contract" would be valid whether signed or not.

Yes - for repayment terms have to be specifically signed for, not just 'part of' your broader employment contract. So if the OP's not signed for anything, they cannot take it from her pay and it would be an unlawful deduction of wages.

KiKi

Uncertain

KiKi wrote: »

Glad somebody mentioned this as I was just about to! OP, does your 4 week notice take you over a year's service?




i

Not the four weeks I'm afraid.

For this purpose only the statutory minimum notice would count - which is one week.

However it wouldn't be the first time an employer has slipped up by giving notice too close the qualifying period.

dramalittlemamma

No unfortunately my 4 weeks notice doesnt take me over the year, i have just read a bit in the works manual that states they may be able to claim back training costs if i leave the service, does this still apply since they have dismissed me, so technically i had no choice in the matter?

marybelle01

KiKi wrote: »

Yes - for repayment terms have to be specifically signed for, not just 'part of' your broader employment contract. So if the OP's not signed for anything, they cannot take it from her pay and it would be an unlawful deduction of wages.

That is exactly what I understood to be the case too. And I also understood that they cannot just "charge you" - they must be able to demonstrate that the cost is fair and reasonable and must deduct from that cost if they have "had use" of the training an element used in the employers business.

Uncertain

dramalittlemamma wrote: »

No unfortunately my 4 weeks notice doesnt take me over the year, i have just read a bit in the works manual that states they may be able to claim back training costs if i leave the service, does this still apply since they have dismissed me, so technically i had no choice in the matter?

I am reasonably sure (95%) that they need a specific agreement for this to be enforceable. Simply putting something in the works manual may well not be enough.

You need to get some specific advice on this point. Are you a union member? Failing that check if your house insurance provides legal cover.

Whilst there is no harm in phoning I wouldn't take the ACAS call centre's advice on this point as gospel. The have a habit of getting more technical points wrong!

What sort of amount are we taling about? If need be it will cost you nothing to make an ET claim for unlawful deduction of wages. It may well be they wouldn't bother defending it because it could easily cost more than the amount in dispute.

ohreally

This employer is on very thin ice.

Does the deduction bring you below NMW?

If the employer had provided for this in the contract, they would still be required to show that the deduction was reasonable - see Fairfield v Skinner. Simply because an employer had a right to make a deduction doesn't mean that he can make a deduction - the two are very different.

Uncertain

ohreally wrote: »

This employer is on very thin ice.

Agreed.

ohreally wrote: »

Does the deduction bring you below NMW?

Not relevant I'm afraid to a final salary payment which is the one time deductions can take you below the NMW.

However, in my view this deduction would be unlawful due to the lack of a specific agreement.

Notmyrealname

marybelle01 wrote: »

Sorry, but I recall SarEl saying exactly the oposite to this.

I doubt it.

dramalittlemamma

I would agree...i feel they are treating me really badly and while a dont really want to go down the route of a work tribunal i feel the deducting money for training is the final straw! its not a lot of money £150 (but i suppose now that i am unemployed ever bit counts) its more about the principle

unfortunately im not in a union