Warning post a letter less than 5mm thick with a normal stamp then the recipient may

Azari

shaun_from_Africa wrote: »

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In which case probably 99% of standard sized letters put through the slot would fail to drop, and this obviously isn't the case.

No, because there are two important variables here:

1) the degree to which the letter is unbalanced.
2) The speed at which the 'operator' pushes the letter through.

I have sent many dozen packages that are close to the 5mm limit (thinish reference manuals), and I have never once been informed by any of my customers that they have had anything extra to pay due to the package being classed as a large letter.

I would imagine this only happens once in a blue moon. After all, they are not going to check ever letter to that extent. No doubt computer controlled systems measure the larger dimensions and weight and possibly divert items close to the thickness limit for further checks.

Then it will depend on how the operator performs the test.

Raksha

It may also depend on the documents being sent - a document made of, say 90 or 100 gsm paper which hasn't been crisply folded, may expand within the envelope meaning it has a depth of more than 5mm if uncompressed. This means it will slip through the gauge easily if pushed fully, but may stick if only pushed part way through.

SeethingSaver

Thanks everyone for all the discussion points here.
Hard to address all individually but what brought my warning about is my posting a passport renewal application a little while ago.
Went in to post office branch as recommended by passport office to establish correct postage.
Counter clerk, in front of my eyes, pushed my letter through the guage, it went through it with no force from what I could see. Letter weighed 52g. and was in the passport office pack pre-adddressed envelope.
But the post office clerk charged me large letter rate.
Quizzed him if that was right and he confirmed is large letter postage, so at that time I thought it was because of the envelope size. I needed to send my passport renewal so had no choice but to cough up for large letter stamp.

When got home checked the leaflet post office had sent when large letter rate introduced.
Saw the passport office envelope was infact within regular letter postage rate size.
Took up the matter with post office and when my passport was returned I reconstructed the envelope I had sent to find the width was at maximum 4mm, 20% under the maximum stated for standard letter rate postage.

Responses I have had from the correspondence delegated case officers of chief executive moya greene have said to me after I pointed all this out (quoting from their letters) :

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quotes from letters

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quote 1- I have spoken to the Area Manager, who has again spoken to the sub postmaster. She has assured me that all staff check items of mail against the gauge. She also said that staff do not try and force items to go through as this is not the correct procedure and could potentially damage or break fragile items. Unfortunately, I can only reiterate what my colleague has advised you that, Royal Mail Guidance states; Push your mail item at least half way through the slot. Your item must fall the rest of the way through under its own weight, without the use of force or manipulation.

quote2 - I have however, as you suggested, tried putting documentation as you have described through the plastic template’s aperture and have to say that there was a level of resistance. For an item to be accepted, in either the letter or large letter formats, the envelope should fall freely through the relevant aperture without any kind of resistance, which I have already stated previously.

Items sent using the letter format will predominantly travel through Royal Mail’s network mechanically. When items outside of the letter format are entered into Royal Mail’s letter sorting machines, there is a possibility that items could become damaged. There is also a strong likelihood that the item could be identified as oversize and would be subject to surcharge at the receiving Delivery Office.

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end

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I remind you that the post office clerk put the letter I sent through the guage in the post office and it went through the guage. The fact he put it all the way through the guage rather contradicts the words from the post office in quote 1 from their letters as they state staff do not try to force items to go through the guage as it could damage them, so he by their words would not have pushed it all the way through as he did if he was in any doubt.

The post office are adamant they are right and I got no reasoning from their postal review.

Try and take the matter to trading standards and you now get citizens advice handling the front end of that operation. They in this new set-up tell me they cannot tell me if trading standards pursued the matter or not.

So this is just a warning to everyone; my letter definitely measured 4mm width and went through the guage in the post office.
If your letter is delayed being delivered and gets a oversize surcharge irrespective of all the size/weight checks you might have done before posting this is a warning of the post office position.

Anyone out there in trading standards themselves and would like to chip in?

custardy

so has this just happened to you?
just its been 6+ years since pricing in proportion came in

SeethingSaver

custardy wrote: »

so has this just happened to you?
just its been 6+ years since pricing in proportion came in

This happened January this year (2012) Keep old leaflets for quite a while as reference just in case !!!

soolin

My passport in an envelope doesnt gp throught the standard letter size slot and I have the standard red one ? Anyway I did as recommended and sent mine special delivery .

kuohu

SeethingSaver wrote: »

... happened January this year ...

Let go, fella, let go.

staffsarge

In all of this, I fail to understand why an item passed through the 5mm gauge, even with a little tugging, does not qualify as a letter. The Royal Mail specifies the measurement and, by deifinition, if something passes through the gauge, even with assistance, it must be less than 5mm. You cannot fit a quart into a pint pot, but you can fit a pint.

custardy

staffsarge wrote: »

In all of this, I fail to understand why an item passed through the 5mm gauge, even with a little tugging, does not qualify as a letter. The Royal Mail specifies the measurement and, by deifinition, if something passes through the gauge, even with assistance, it must be less than 5mm. You cannot fit a quart into a pint pot, but you can fit a pint.

well you can if you can squash it down
should we make it that if an item is less than 5mm with a 20kg weight on it then its fine?
The part in red indicates that its more than 5m but can be compressed to fit
would you agree?

Raksha

If the gauge is solid, then no amount of assistance will allow something which is more than 5mm to pass through. Therefore, by definition, if the item passes through it must by 5mm or less.