Tailgating should be made a criminal offence

cyclonebri1

martinthebandit wrote: »

1. It is bad driving to carry out a manouver that causes someone else to change direction, speed etc, the fact that you have caused someone else to slow down consequently means that you started your overtake without knowing that it was clear to do so.

.

I have to use that quote in defence of what I said earlier, either slowing or speeding up ARE manoeuvre's, and slowing down will result in the follower doing one or the other, simples.

hareng

northstar23 wrote: »

IWhile overtaking a car on a two lane motorway it became 4 lanes due to traffic joining from an A Road. First two lanes contained lorries, third lane a car doing 68 ish, and me in the outside doing 70.

I have to ask, what was your intention if car in front was doing 68mph, whats 2mph and how longs that going to take if someone was already coming up behind causing them to manouver.
I think theres more to this than revealed but doesnt warrant tail gaiting.

martinthebandit

northstar23 wrote: »

If your passenger films tailgating on a mobile phone is that evidence of any use to the CPS?

I got tailgated the other day through no fault of my own. While overtaking a car on a two lane motorway it became 4 lanes due to traffic joining from an A Road. First two lanes contained lorries, third lane a car doing 68 ish, and me in the outside doing 70. The road then switched to steep uphill, and my fully laden 1.4 Fiesta simply ran out of power and it took me a good half mile to overtake inch by inch.

Whilst overtaking I had a Range Rover Sport latch onto the bumper and flash headlights constantly, and on the rare occasions he dropped back a few feet I could see a face contorted into absolute rage. My partner and I weren't that bothered, but it did cross my mind to film it and see if it went anywhere. Pretty quickly realised that both phones were in luggage on the back seat and inaccesable.

I fail to see how being tailgated was my fault (as a few people on here would seem to argue in these circumstances), but no doubt the pious will slaughter me for not being aware of the road, the weight of my vehicle and its power and for having the temerity to get in the way of a Range Rover. The fact is though that I have as much right to use the road as anyone and I was bang on the speed limit anyway.

The guy overtook us by sweeping to the inside lane and then straight back accross the motorway whilst giving us every hand signal possible and shouting abuse.

Its a bit gutting that the chances of this type of driving ever being prosected, hence my question about mobile phone evidence.

I think you have just proved mine, and others, point.

Thanks

cyclonebri1

What's the point of photography when an accident has happened?, the issue is to prevent it happening, not aportion blame later????

Am I wrong??

northstar23

hareng - there really is very little more to add.

I was coming down the stretch of two lane motorway and pulled out to overtake another vehicle. At this point the outside lane was clear. I got alongside the car and then it seemed to speed up significantly until it was pretty much at the same speed as me. I can only assume he did this due to the traffic joining from the left hand side. As I said the road then switched to steep uphill (A2/M2 junction at Cobham Hill if anyone knows it) and we found ourselves in lanes 3 and 4. I ran out of power so had to try and complete the overtake slowly, and at this point the Range Rover screamed up behind me and started flashing. I wouldn't normally have been out that wide but due to circumstances and me forgetting that stretch of road had a merge as I hadn't travelled it for some time meant I was. I maintain I had every right to do so. In an ideal world I wouldn't have been.

I think you have just proved mine, and others, point.

Thanks

I'm not even sure if your inferring I'm a plank for daring to inhabit the outside lane in a slow-ish vehicle, or saying I had every right to be there and no right to be tailgated.

martinthebandit

northstar23 wrote: »

I'm not even sure if your inferring I'm a plank for daring to inhabit the outside lane in a slow-ish vehicle, or saying I had every right to be there and no right to be tailgated.

Well lets get this clear then, you were in a potentially dangerous situation while driving, being tailgated, and did nothing to make the situation safer.

You didn't see the signs giving notice that the dual carriageway you were on was going to be joined by another two lanes.

You were overtaking a vehicle that was doing 68 but didn't want to break the law by going faster than 70, (which is fair enough) you could have slowed by 2 mph and pulled in behind the 68 mph vehicle but decided not to, presumably because you felt that would have held you up too long?

But of course you pulled over a lane as soon as it was safe to do so, but there again the tailgater had time to move over a lane, undertake you and then pull out into the outside lane again, so no you didn't, did you.

So, bearing in mind, a responsible, good driver would try and make any potentially dangerous situation safer, irrespective of who is in the wrong, I think you know what category I think your in.

Again though I am happy to apologise if I am wrong.

northstar23

You didn't see the signs giving notice that the dual carriageway you were on was going to be joined by another two lanes.

You were overtaking a vehicle that was doing 68 but didn't want to break the law by going faster than 70, (which is fair enough) you could have slowed by 2 mph and pulled in behind the 68 mph vehicle but decided not to, presumably because you felt that would have held you up too long?

But of course you pulled over a lane as soon as it was safe to do so, but there again the tailgater had time to move over a lane, undertake you and then pull out into the outside lane again, so no you didn't, did you.

So, bearing in mind, a responsible, good driver would try and make any potentially dangerous situation safer, irrespective of who is in the wrong, I think you know what category I think your in.

1st Point - I hadn't travelled that section of road in a while and forgot the A2/M2 merged. Sue me.

2nd Point - I would have had no issue heading up to 75 or 80 to complete the pass and get back in asap, but as I've said twice the road switched to steep uphill and I ran out of power. I wasn't unwilling to do the extra speed, just unable. I could indeed have eased off but at this point the Rangey was so close behind any loss of speed could have had bad consequences.

3rd point - I pulled over as soon as I could... not sure how much bhp the RR has on tap but he completed the whole manoever in 2 - 3 seconds. Not much I could have done tbh.

4th point - I'm an OK driver. I don't have an ego about it and want to claim I'm the next Lewis Hamilton. I did what I could. I humbly apologise that I'm not in your league of awesomeness and I hope and pray that in this lifetime or another I don't do anything to hold you up Sir. I appreciate next to you I have no place to be on the road... perhaps they could create special idiot lanes for me and the 99% of other drivers not in your catagory of talent?

Paperbird

interstellaflyer wrote: »

Did you actually read my post? I think not.

Who said anything about pulling out in front of a car going faster than me? I certainly didn't.

And

As for the 200 yard gap, I never said or even implied that I wouldn't pull in if there was a 200 yard gap, I said that I pull in as soon as I'm clear of the vehicle I'm overtaking that means pulling in without cutting them up, Could you tell, where in the Highway Code does it say that a driver that is already doing the maximum speed allowed on that road and is legitimately overtaking slower moving vehicles, must immediately pull over, potentially cutting up the vehicle you are overtaking just to allow some one past who is speeding, often, especially on my local stretch of the A34 you get long convoys of wagons and they sit quite dangerously close together, if you did pull in to the small gap you would a) need to slow down to their speed and b) have an angy truck driver up your chuff.

Yes I did read it and I think this implies you don't pull into a 200yd gap.

" if I am doing that limit and overtaking properly ie pulling back in when tha gap is safe rather than staying out because there are other slower vehicles 200 yards away then as far as I'm concerned, I driving perfectly within the law"

martinthebandit

northstar23 wrote: »

1st Point - I hadn't travelled that section of road in a while and forgot the A2/M2 merged. Sue me.

..... and didn't see the signs either.

northstar23 wrote: »

2nd Point - I would have had no issue heading up to 75 or 80 to complete the pass and get back in asap, but as I've said twice the road switched to steep uphill and I ran out of power. I wasn't unwilling to do the extra speed, just unable. I could indeed have eased off but at this point the Rangey was so close behind any loss of speed could have had bad consequences.

...... and failed to anticipate the hill either

northstar23 wrote: »

3rd point - I pulled over as soon as I could... not sure how much bhp the RR has on tap but he completed the whole manoever in 2 - 3 seconds. Not much I could have done tbh.

......... of course if it took him 4 or more seconds you could have safely pulled into the gap.

northstar23 wrote: »

4th point - I'm an OK driver. I don't have an ego about it and want to claim I'm the next Lewis Hamilton. I did what I could. I humbly apologise that I'm not in your league of awesomeness and I hope and pray that in this lifetime or another I don't do anything to hold you up Sir. I appreciate next to you I have no place to be on the road... perhaps they could create special idiot lanes for me and the 99% of other drivers not in your catagory of talent?

I don't think you need to be in a special idiot lane, nor do I think 99% of other drivers do.

What I do think is that all drivers should try their best to read the road and be courteous to others, even idiot tailgaters.

It is also good practice, when instances of bad driving occur around you, to consider what actions were/had been taken and reflect on what you could have done better.

I also think it is very sensible, when potentially dangerous driving is going on around you, to do your best to make the situation better.

I don't think any of those comments need Mr Sarcasm to come out of his box, bet hey ho clearly you do.


Oh and actually yes, 30 years of constant training and assessment etc for driving with blues and twos probably does make me a better driver than most, although it doesn't always make me right, but I still try and learn every time I am on the road, do you?

northstar23

What I do think is that all drivers should try their best to read the road and be courteous to others, even idiot tailgaters.

It is also good practice, when instances of bad driving occur around you, to consider what actions were/had been taken and reflect on what you could have done better.

I also think it is very sensible, when potentially dangerous driving is going on around you, to do your best to make the situation better.

Agree with all 3 points. Although I would argue that in my judgement I held my speed and course and made no sudden changes in either which I believe would have led to a worse situaiton. Its all subjective. As to not anticipating the hill and all that... yes I was chatting with someone and allowed life and the road to go on by. Exactly as I suspect most other motorists do. I'm guessing you've never missed a road sign or potential hazard in your entire driving career? If not congratulations and I accept the rebuke. If you have... people in glass houses etc.

Oh and actually yes, 30 years of constant training and assessment etc for driving with blues and twos probably does make me a better driver than most,

Funnily enough I know two guys who did a similar amount of time in London driving response cars for the Met and they never displayed that kind of arrogance. Probably why I quite liked them.