Is Greece all sorted now?

michaels

True but would wall street be insulated from any economic fallout - markets crashing and banks going broke never looks good for an incumbent...

Thrugelmir wrote: »

How many Americans do you think even know where Greece is?

Let alone have any interest in Europe.

Loughton_Monkey

Thrugelmir wrote: »

How many Americans do you think even know where Greece is?

Let alone have any interest in Europe.

Totally correct.

I spent the whole of February in USA, and visited a relative of a friend in Savanna, Georgia.

I was asked to get onto Google, with a world map, and point where England was and how close it is to the United Kingdom!

Dutifully, and tactfully, I explained the whole deal with England, Gt Britain, UK etc. But rather less tactfully, told the lady that we have a saying in England "Wars are nature's way of teaching Geography to Americans."

This was met with a blank stare. Not because of the sarcasm, but simply because she couldn't see the 'joke'. After I explained it to her, she became very inquisitive, saying "Wars? We start wars? No. America doesn't start wars."

"What about Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam?" I asked.

Again, a blank stare. "We didn't start those.... did we?". And then "They don't teach us this at school."

Generali

It's not just Americans that are bad at history. My mate taught English in Japan and brought up some of the excesses of WW2 (e.g. Sex slavery, treatment of prisoners, forced labour) and was met with shocked disbelief.

The British get a very one-eyed view of history: French schools teach a very different picture of the events during the Agincourt massacre and the cowardly abandonment of France by her supposed British ally at Dunkirk, let alone the shelling of Paris by the Americans because they would rather kill French citizens than have a few soldiers die.

How many Europeans can name even the major US state capitals, roughly place the mid West on a map or say what the difference is between the state capital and its Capitol?

Zorz_2

This one is not Godwin's law, this one is for real:

Laurie Penny: It's not rhetoric to draw parallels with Nazism
Actual fascists in actual black shirts are waving swastikas and murdering ethnic minorities in Athens.

ILW

Why are Greece not just cut loose.They seem to have very little appetite to sort out their own mess and just seem to blame everybody else. They did seem rather keen to spend a lot of money they did not earn, but now seem to have trouble grasping the fact that it should be repaid.

Graham_Devon

Did they get the bailout? Or is it still dragging on? It went very quiet. I know some guys had gone to inspect the books as it were, and merkel started frowning, but it all went quiet?

Thrugelmir

Zorz wrote: »

This one is not Godwin's law, this one is for real:

Laurie Penny: It's not rhetoric to draw parallels with Nazism
Actual fascists in actual black shirts are waving swastikas and murdering ethnic minorities in Athens.

Given that Greece suffered terribly under German occupation during WW2. Makes you wonder where the homeland of these individuals lies.

Loughton_Monkey

ILW wrote: »

Why are Greece not just cut loose.........

Simple answer, the €.

In effect, UK is 'cut loose' by the simple fact we have our own currency. Hence we will sink or swim by our own efforts, and when all else fails, we will print money to put the books straight.

Greece can't do that.

To think that they could be cast out from the € is a folly. If we imagine, hypothetically, the North of England was considered so poor and unproductive, that everyone north of a line between the Wash and the Bristol Channel were going to have to have financial independance under a newly denoted currency of the "Northern Groat", under the auspices of the Bank of the North.

If it were certain that the minute partition happened, every resident was going to be given 1 Northern Groat per £, but that the minute after, it would be worth about 70 pence (and falling).

There is not a single Northern person who would not deposit every £ they had into a Southern bank. Then wait for the devaluation, after which they could convert £10K to 15,000 Northern Groats. i.e. Parity.

Defeats the object, really.

So cut Greece loose, and the rest of the Eurozone pays just the same. But could never get anything back in a Greek recovery. A bit like a wayward son who, by law, has access to your chequebook and insists on spend, spend, spend. Explain, cajole, bully, reprimand all you like. But it won't work.

ILW

By cut loose, I meant simply stop giving them more money. Take the chequebook away from them. Whether they stay in the Euro or not is up to them.

Loughton_Monkey

ILW wrote: »

By cut loose, I meant simply stop giving them more money. Take the chequebook away from them. Whether they stay in the Euro or not is up to them.

So first thing that happens is they cannot pay their debts. Nobody will lend them anything.

Next thing, everyone looks at Spain, Italy, Portugal, Ireland, and assume they won't pay either. So they don't get their loans renewed either, so cannot pay their debts.

Then all the German, French, Dutch loans etc. can only be renewed at double the interest (if lucky) forcing them into bankruptcy sooner or later.

Now the whole Eurozone is technically bankrupt. They can't therefore trade. They will become subsistance economies.

Countries like UK, Denmark, Norway etc. will have to step in and fill all the Eurozone's previous export markets....... hang on! You're right. To hell with Greece.