Work programme and JSA agreement

Joy111

@TheMissus - this poster has pointed you in our direction at unemployment movement, as I can't post a link either. We can tell you all your rights, we have letters, legals all available to anyone who needs it.

Do not sign away your rights purely because you are unemployed. I have a particular gripe with WP as these providers paid put to my job at JCPlus and later the Inland Revenue- so I have good inside knowledge. We are quite friendly!

elaine12022

marybelle, I'm afraid I have to disagree. If you look at the job seekers agreement it says

1. steps

to find work.

This explains it well

The JSA regulations give the following as examples of job seeking activities:
applying for jobs (either orally or in writing);
obtaining information about job vacancies;
registering with an employment agency;
following referral by an employment officer, seeking specialist advice on improving your job prospects with regard to any physical or mental limitations that you may have;
putting together a CV;
obtaining a reference or testimonial from a previous employer;
compiling a list of employers who may be able to offer you work and seeking information from them;
seeking information about an occupation with a view to seeking employment in that occupation.
The DWP Decision Maker's Guide states that "any other steps can be taken into account providing they give claimants their best
chance of finding employment"

http://www.benefitsnow.co.uk/jsa/actively.asp(lots of good info on here)

My OH is on jsa so I know something about it. He also used to work for the DWP.

Jerry_Mander

Hi LizJ

The provider can pretty much ask your son to do anything which is realistic and reasonable given his known disabilities. This is part of the 'black box' approach that the DWP granted to the providers.

But, given the economic conditions at present and your son's disabilities, applying for ten jobs per week seems unreasonable to me.

What you need to do is go back to the provider and ask them to sit with your son and show him how to apply for those ten jobs, that is what they're there for after all, to help your son return to sustainable employment.

If your son feels that he can't do the job searches without continuous help from the provider then tell them that, it's their duty to provide whatever help is needed to enable him to fulfill their (reasonable) demands. Throw any genuine problems your son has, which in any way affect his ability to job search, straight back at them.

It is totally unreasonable to just state that he has to apply for ten jobs and leave it at that.

As to his JSAG, he must continue to carry out whatever he agreed to on the JSAG and then do anything else the provider has required him to do.

Remember though that (at least in theory) the activities that the provider asks you to do are mutually agreed between them and your son. He does not have to agree to do anything if it is not reasonable, but that requires good negotiating skills which your son probably lacks.

marybelle01

elaine12022 wrote: »

marybelle, I'm afraid I have to disagree. If you look at the job seekers agreement it says

1. steps

to find work.

This explains it well

The JSA regulations give the following as examples of job seeking activities:
applying for jobs (either orally or in writing);
obtaining information about job vacancies;
registering with an employment agency;
following referral by an employment officer, seeking specialist advice on improving your job prospects with regard to any physical or mental limitations that you may have;
putting together a CV;
obtaining a reference or testimonial from a previous employer;
compiling a list of employers who may be able to offer you work and seeking information from them;
seeking information about an occupation with a view to seeking employment in that occupation.
The DWP Decision Maker's Guide states that "any other steps can be taken into account providing they give claimants their best
chance of finding employment"

http://www.benefitsnow.co.uk/jsa/actively.asp(lots of good info on here)

My OH is on jsa so I know something about it. He also used to work for the DWP.

This is guidance - not law as you stated. And regardless of what that guidance may say, I cannot seriously credit that anyone taking only "three steps", none of which actually involve applying for a job at all would last long before they were sanctioned. Or are you seriously trying to tell me that the JC / DWP do not expect people to apply for work?

donnajunkie

marybelle01 wrote: »

This is going to sound utterly stupid, but bear with me. He is trying too hard. He is applying for three suitable vacancies. That's his problem. So apply for seven UNSUITABLE one's! That's ten applications. Sometimes with bureaucracy, it's easier to go with the flow than fight it. You and he both know that a whole load of employers, quite wrongly, won't consider him at all, suitable or not. So it shouldn't be an uphill task to apply to people who won't consider him. And besides which, you just never know. Maybe, just maybe, one of those employers actually may not be prejudiced and think that he isn't suitable for this job, but what about that other thing we have going … Stranger things have happened!

yes do this but dont obviously take the pee and apply for things like rocket scientist. yes rocket scientist is a silly example but you get my point.

donnajunkie

Horace wrote: »

it is something to be avoided as you cannot go back to the jobcentre (how true this is I am not sure but this is what I was told by the jobcentre yesterday).

The providers of the Work Programme don't care about the individual all they care about is getting money from the government which they get regardless of how many people they help into work or not.



What I understood about the Work Programme was that you could not claim JSA for 2 years once you were in their clutches.

once on the work programme you still sign on with the jobcentre. the jobcentre will regain full responsibility for you when you finish the work programme.

the providers mainly get paid on results. they dont get paid a load of money regardless.

you are on the work programme for 2 years but you continue to get jsa while you are on it. it does not stop you getting jsa if you qualify for it.

The_ICT_Engineer

donnajunkie wrote: »

yes do this but dont obviously take the pee and apply for things like rocket scientist. yes rocket scientist is a silly example but you get my point.

Actually I do know a rocket scientist.

Horace

OP - Get your son to refer himself to Remploy. Whenever I attend for job search there is always a member of staff on hand to advise and to help complete forms if necessary. I also see a personal adviser every month (sometimes more times because I will see her in passing and sometimes she pulls me to one side to talk about something that has come up). Remploy work on behalf of people with all kinds of disabilities. They have been great for me.

I was told by my advisor at the jobcentre today that I am due to be placed on this wretched work programme on 21 September which will shut me off from any help from the jobcentre. I am trying to get some voluntary work in the meantime as well as keep applying for jobs. Today the jobcentre told me about something local to me which is a learning hub based at the major hospital in the city - they test your skills and help you decide what job in the NHS would be best for you (they only take unemployed people) and you get to spend time in various departments trying out jobs. As the NHS is continually recruiting you get to hear about jobs before they go out to the wider world and you are invited to apply but you must do the application yourself. Why they didnt tell me this months ago I do not know because I am now on their waiting list and can expect to hear from them during the second week of September.

marybelle01

Horace wrote: »

OP - Get your son to refer himself to Remploy. .

Much as I would normally agree - they are laying off thousands, and balloting for strike action (if the ballot hasn't yet come in - I've lost touch a bit). Proud to see the unions organising people with disabilities, and credit to the GMB on this one (possibly others, but I think the GMB is the main union). Their budget has been massively cut by the dynamic duo, who don't believe in subsidised but meaningful work for the disabled - only subsidised and not at all meaningful work for huge businesses with stacks of profit.

kazzah60

OP
My son has similar disabilities to your son and his DEA was VERY clear that if at ANY point he was told he needed to take more than 3 steps towards looking for employment per week by ANYBODY that my son was to refer them back to the DEA as the DEA is the ONLY person who can make adjustments to the agreement - this might be worth a try - otherwise it might be worth looking into a complaint about discrimination under the Equalities act 2010

good luck - there aren't that many opportunities out there for kids like ours - my son was lucky and got a job after 7 months - but it was more by luck than anything